We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
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Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#42As an outsider looking in on the Scientific process, I am not really sure how applicable my opinions are, but I see these as useful changes.
Basically, in reverse order, my suggestions for science to adopt are as follows:
Papers in databases need to have fields related to reproduction studies, and it needs to start becoming a prideful part of the scientific process; just as there is a lot of pride and money, researchers should start to thump their chest based on the reproducibility of their work, actively seeking out contemporaries and requesting a reproduction study as part of the pubilshing process, and subsequently updating.
The papers published themselves should take a moment (perhaps no more than a paragraph) to include a "for media" section that outlines the "do's and don't's" on reporting on the research. For example, cancer research should clearly state examples of acceptable understandings in lay person terms as a sort of catch for sloppy reporting. Something like "Do not write "cure for cancer found" or "Effective treatment", instead write "progress made, etc". Basically put a sucker punch to outlandish headlines and reporting right in the paper itself, and let journalists who want to be sensationalist embarrass themselves.
This seems like two very simple acts that could raise the bar for science a bit.
Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, there's the GPL-styled approach: anyone with access to the results must also have access to the associated data. This doesn't mean it is mandatory to make it public, though you'd have to restrict the redistribution freedom.
I recently used a large dataset of tweets in a research project. As far as I know, I do not have the rights to distribute these. I also used a dataset consisting of newspaper articles. It cost me $1.000 to get access to, and I definitely do not have the rights to redistribute it.
Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#44I disagree. One part of science is observation. Including observations which cannot be, or at least have not been, repeated. For example, consider a rare event in astronomy which has only been detected once. Is that science? I say it is. But it's surely not repeatable. (Even if something like it is detected in the future, is it really a "repeat"?) Some experiments are immoral to repeat. For example, in a drug trial y…
First off, you can accept the observation at face value as an observation, but conclusions drawn from the claims which have no other support or means of verification should not be accepted and would not be accepted. Fortunately, most of the time even if something is initially sparked by a very rare occurrence, it will have some kind of implications that are verifiable by some other means other than just waiting for something to happen in space.
But even something that is rare and relies on observation, like gravitational waves, we have already been able to identify more than one occurrence.
> Some experiments are immoral to repeat. For example, in a drug trial you may find that 95% survive with a given treatment, while only 5% survive with the placebo.
What's more immoral, releasing a drug that's only had one test, even a striking one, on the public as a miracle cure that you have not truly verified or performing another test to actually be sure of your claims before you release it?
> Who among you is going to argue that someone else needs to repeat that experiment before we regard it as a proper scientific result?
That's how science works. If something is not independently repeatable and verifiable then science breaks down. Look at the recent EM drive. Most scientists in the field were skeptical of it, and once it was finally attempted to be independently verified the problems were found.
Independent verification is the cornerstone of science and what makes it different from bogus claims by charlatans.
Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#45I'm a physician and I've been suggesting this to my colleagues for a few years, only to be met with alienated stares and labeled cynical. The doctors and doctors-in-training I work with have altruistic motives, but place too much stock in major medical studies. They also frequently apply single-study findings to patient care, even to patients that would've been excluded from that study (saw this a lot with the recent…
but in medicine, what is the practical alternative? how do you incorporate these findings? ignore them? if so, it's probably bad for your patients. the only thing worse than a single-study finding is a zero-study finding.
Let me give you an example of how I approach things. The guidelines for acute pancreatitis recommend using a fluid called LR instead of NS for volume resuscitation. This is based on an single study that included 10 patients and simply noted slightly better lab numbers; there was no difference in clinical outcome. Lots of problems with that study, right (small, underpowered, confounders, validity issues, etc)? However, there's no major disadvantage for using LR in those patients (unless hyperkalemia is a concern), so I use it since it might have a benefit.
This is a very simple example. It gets much more complicated than that.
"Probably" is one of favorite words in medicine, btw :).
Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#46I think with the increased visibility of scientific research to the general public, it's less that science needs to stop accepting unrepeated results, but instead the paper process needs to be updated to reflect the new level of availability, and journal databases need better relationship views between papers and repeated tests. As an outsider looking in on the Scientific process, I am not really sure how applicable…
Of course, they probably do know this and just choose to ignore it because "Unverified Study that MIGHT Point to M&M's Being Good For You" won't get as many clicks as "M&M's Are Good For You Says New Study!"
Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#47Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
For CS, reproducing should be easy given the code and input data right? Other sciences' input isn't so easily shared
Ideally you should re-implement the algorithm based on the description in the paper to verify that the description of the algorithm is correct. You should also test with your own data to make sure that the algorithm works on all reasonable data and not only on some provided cherry picked data. If you can't get the expected results with your own implementation and your own data then the results aren't reproduced.
Re: We Should Not Accept Scientific Results That Have Not Been Repeated
#49I'm a physician and I've been suggesting this to my colleagues for a few years, only to be met with alienated stares and labeled cynical. The doctors and doctors-in-training I work with have altruistic motives, but place too much stock in major medical studies. They also frequently apply single-study findings to patient care, even to patients that would've been excluded from that study (saw this a lot with the recent…
Personal experience (I've met many pre- and current doctors during my studies) suggests that few doctors are scientists . They know a lot of things, but they're not what I'd call scientists in the same way a physicist or biologist would be (and I've often wondered why they'd get a "Doctorate" at all). So this might explain the abovementioned behaviour... Yet I'm surprised by your colleagues behaviour nonetheless. I w…
I think the problem is that it's simpler to just take a study's conclusion and believe it. Because hey, it's peer-reviewed and in the NEJM! Easy!
The adverse reaction I described is normal in medicine when you oppose the status quo. That's probably true in other professions and industries.