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My Interviews with Amazon

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Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#161

Post by justinv »

inopinatus wrote: post #128
larrik wrote: post #3

Interesting, I get pestered by them constantly, and never actually considered going for it. For one thing, the common sentiment on HN seems to be 'friends don't let friends work for Amazon'. Amazon seems like a meat grinder, where getting hired isn't as hard as it seems, and they just burn through young people who don't know better. This is as someone completely on the outside who's only heard stories, though. When I…

I'm ex-AWS. Actually an ex-AWS hiring manager. My experience is at odds with the negative stories. What Amazon has is a culture with a strong flavour. Like all strong flavours, I think you're going to either love it or loathe it. I had a fantastic team to work with - they were all either ex-tech-sector CTOs or equivalent or they had that level of potential. So as the team manager I had permanent case of imposter synd…

I'm at Amazon (non-tech; 3 different orgs; so literally NYTimes' focus or whatnot).

Your first paragraph is exactly how I describe Amazon to people. You either love the culture - or you hate it. There are very few people I know who are ambivalent about working there.

It's hard work. It's important work. It's demanding work. It's not for everyone.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#162

Post by Bartweiss »

arunpn123 wrote: post #124
sgk284 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bezos set a mandate to HR a few years ago that he wanted them to be able to hire a new grad without ever needing to speak to a human engineer. That is, he wants the entire interview process automated (specifically for new grads, at least for now). What you experienced is part of their experiment in figuring out how to make this work. They've got a number of variations of interviews going on right now. I believe this…

Anecdotal evidence: I know some new grads who took this test when Amazon rolled out this automated form of hiring 2 years back. There were several crazy things with this process.. the questions in the test were changed only once a week and they did actually make offers to new grads after just the 3 hour online test. In dorm rooms where a bunch of students are applying for jobs at the same time, news travels fast. In…

This seems nuts, but it would explain some things.

Somehow I saw "fully automated hiring" and couldn't believe it - I just assumed it would be automated until the onsite part. If you're hiring 100% automated, I can definitely see why you'd be paranoid about cheating, but you'd better have an answer to memorization!

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#163

Post by serge2k »

riot504 wrote: post #106
wernercd wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm at a new job where the "old team" of two developers is being replaced by 5 devs... the old team had ~15 years of experience and can't code their way out of a wet paper bag. Not saying anything about YOU... experience is important... but 15 years experience doesn't mean 15 years of good experience or lack of bad habits.

Only in programming would this type of statement hold any merit. I was an air traffic controller for 10 years prior to becoming a data scientist. Experience is more than just being able to code (or do your specific job), it brings a wealth of knowledge you have to yet notice or realize.

> Experience is more than just being able to code

Necessary, but not sufficient. If you can't code you're worthless as a developer. You can be a great coder, but if your other skills are poor you aren't worth a senior engineer salary.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#164

Post by 1_2__3 »

ryanlm wrote: post #138
throwaway52584 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm picturing a wide-eyed lamb wandering into the lion's den. "Hai guys! Let's have conversations LOL."

I meant design discussions, etc. Not just a code monkey. I'm sorry you think it is funny that I actually want to participate in the development process. Don't worry, at my current job, I know my place. I make sure not overstep bounds, etc. Also, maybe I haven't been an Enterprise Fizzbuzz Java Developer for 6 years, but I've been keeping busy by having personal projects that most enterprise developers would probably…

Right, we know. Every new grad thinks it's going to be high-level design discussions. It won't be. You'll be a code monkey.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#165

Post by serge2k »

ktRolster wrote: post #154
dominotw wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I applied to amazon last month, they asked me to do interviewstreet coding for 2 hrs. After that Recruiter didn't even have the minimum courtesy to let me know what happened. He simply stopped all communications with me. Reflects their attitude of treating ppl as mere 'resources' , I would work for amazon if I have no self-respect.

After that Recruiter didn't even have the minimum courtesy to let me know what happened. That's pretty common recently for companies. I'm not sure why.

Some claim it's them covering their ass thanks to the SUE SUE SUE culture of the US.

I understand that, but when it's a purely technical decision they could easily enough give you constructive feedback.

You missed these two edge cases. Your code crashes on certain inputs. This is very inefficient, you could have done XYZ.

You could automate chunks of this, and protect yourself from any discrimination lawsuits by just making any engineer who reviews the code have zero knowledge of the candidate.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#166

Post by serge2k »

superuser2 wrote: post #149
Bartweiss wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. That's part of why I stressed that it didn't seem to be standard Amazon policy - it looked like some hiring agent had decided "No fraud on my watch!" and pushed through an aggressive policy to make it happen. My complaint was that it seemed both ineffective (imagine candidates with the Big-O cheatsheet taped above their monitor) and obnoxious (I wasn't even going to talk to an employee until I jumped thro…

>imagine candidates with the Big-O cheatsheet taped above their monitor You need some interesting mental gymnastics to explain why this is even a problem, given that they could easily have the same cheatsheet taped on their cubicle wall after getting the job.

and you don't have it during the onsite.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#167

Post by ryanlm »

1_2__3 wrote: post #164
ryanlm wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I meant design discussions, etc. Not just a code monkey. I'm sorry you think it is funny that I actually want to participate in the development process. Don't worry, at my current job, I know my place. I make sure not overstep bounds, etc. Also, maybe I haven't been an Enterprise Fizzbuzz Java Developer for 6 years, but I've been keeping busy by having personal projects that most enterprise developers would probably…

Right, we know. Every new grad thinks it's going to be high-level design discussions. It won't be. You'll be a code monkey.

Who is "we"? Also why would it be a code monkey job?

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#168

Post by Bartweiss »

ktRolster wrote: post #154
dominotw wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I applied to amazon last month, they asked me to do interviewstreet coding for 2 hrs. After that Recruiter didn't even have the minimum courtesy to let me know what happened. He simply stopped all communications with me. Reflects their attitude of treating ppl as mere 'resources' , I would work for amazon if I have no self-respect.

After that Recruiter didn't even have the minimum courtesy to let me know what happened. That's pretty common recently for companies. I'm not sure why.

The worst I've seen is a recruiter that didn't tell me I had been accepted. I found out when someone at the company followed up on why I hadn't responded to the offer.

I have no idea how a commission-based business manages to do something like that.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#169

Post by riot504 »

serge2k wrote: post #163
riot504 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only in programming would this type of statement hold any merit. I was an air traffic controller for 10 years prior to becoming a data scientist. Experience is more than just being able to code (or do your specific job), it brings a wealth of knowledge you have to yet notice or realize.

> Experience is more than just being able to code Necessary, but not sufficient. If you can't code you're worthless as a developer. You can be a great coder, but if your other skills are poor you aren't worth a senior engineer salary.

No one is saying the experienced individuals cannot code. Based on OP's comment I am going to assume he/she is young based on my personal experience hearing these types of comments throughout my career. They stem from only knowing one way of approaching a task, to which they respond negatively to anything different, particularly if it is outdated. Instead they should seek to learn from the experienced individuals and understand why they are solving the problems in that particular manner.

Re: My Interviews with Amazon

#170

Post by Bartweiss »

superuser2 wrote: post #149
Bartweiss wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. That's part of why I stressed that it didn't seem to be standard Amazon policy - it looked like some hiring agent had decided "No fraud on my watch!" and pushed through an aggressive policy to make it happen. My complaint was that it seemed both ineffective (imagine candidates with the Big-O cheatsheet taped above their monitor) and obnoxious (I wasn't even going to talk to an employee until I jumped thro…

>imagine candidates with the Big-O cheatsheet taped above their monitor You need some interesting mental gymnastics to explain why this is even a problem, given that they could easily have the same cheatsheet taped on their cubicle wall after getting the job.

That's true - this all assumes that the existing "no resources but a whiteboard" system is even worth reproducing.
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