Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll • Hacker News Board

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#51

Post by perspectivep » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:44 PM UTC

ivraatiems wrote: post #29

sp332 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, just type then? I use Cortana to set reminders occasionally, but I can't remember the last time I used the voice interface. My PC at home doesn't even have a microphone.

Oh yeah, I do. The problem is that Cortana has supplanted basic search functionality. As far as I can tell, when you type a search in the Start menu you're still going through Cortana, technically (that's why she's always running even when she's turned off from listening to you). Cortana has access to a limited subset of your computer. She can't search things outside your C:\Users\[your username] directory. Regular W…

You're upset that search got rebranded to Cortana? It can definitely search your entire PC. I just typed the name of a script I have sitting on my D: drive and pressed enter and it opened it.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#52

Post by tedunangst » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:44 PM UTC

ryanlm wrote: post #38

sp332 wrote: post #2

Not just the web either. This morning Cortana turned green and said "Oh hey!" in my taskbar. I clicked it and it gave me the regular interface - there was no alert or anything, they just wanted to boost their Cortana interaction numbers for the day. That's wasting my time and making it less likely that I will pay attention if there is an actual alert later.

It seems like your first problem is you're using Windows 10. You agreed to let them do what they want with THEIR operating system.

I've found nearly every operating system I use tends to change and do what "they" want.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#53

Post by yedpodtrzitko » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:46 PM UTC

The worst thing I've seen is G2A Shield - it takes 10 steps to deactivate it, and each step has the "cancel" button much more dominant than the "continue" button, see: http://imgur.com/a/PUwPC

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#54

Post by ivraatiems » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:46 PM UTC

perspectivep wrote: post #51

ivraatiems wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh yeah, I do. The problem is that Cortana has supplanted basic search functionality. As far as I can tell, when you type a search in the Start menu you're still going through Cortana, technically (that's why she's always running even when she's turned off from listening to you). Cortana has access to a limited subset of your computer. She can't search things outside your C:\Users\[your username] directory. Regular W…

You're upset that search got rebranded to Cortana? It can definitely search your entire PC. I just typed the name of a script I have sitting on my D: drive and pressed enter and it opened it.

It can't. I have a Super User post [1] that describes the problem in detail. Windows Search and Cortana appear to be two separate things. If what I describe in my post is working on your computer, we should talk... I need to find a solution to this issue and Microsoft Support couldn't help.

Can you tell me - do you have Cortana's voice stuff enabled? Do you have her "learning" about you enabled in settings? Did you upgrade to W10 or do a fresh install?

[1] http://superuser.com/questions/1105529/cant-search-folders-o...

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#55

Post by ryanlm » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:46 PM UTC

tedunangst wrote: post #52

ryanlm wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like your first problem is you're using Windows 10. You agreed to let them do what they want with THEIR operating system.

I've found nearly every operating system I use tends to change and do what "they" want.

Sure. With Debian, you can choose NOT to update it.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#56

Post by cptskippy » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:47 PM UTC

oblio wrote: post #44

SNvD7vEJ wrote: post #18

Adobe flash update notification always have the McAfee Antivirus trial installer pre-selected by default. Pisses me off every time.

Reader has the same thing :(

I uninstalled Reader when in started forcing UI toolbars to be open an visible every time a PDF was opened even after I'd explicitly hidden them. I haven't looked back either.

I have yet to encounter a PDF that doesn't render correctly in FireFox's built in PDF.JS. I know Reader has additional features but I've honestly never used them. You can easily set FireFox as your default PDF view and you're off to the races.

My only gripe is the PDF icon is now FireFox's icon.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#57

Post by gthtjtkt » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:47 PM UTC

Experienced this recently with Hello Fresh. The 'Cancel Subscription' button was so hard to find that I had to spend 10 minutes Googling it (the placement had changed over time and was always difficult to find, so a lot of the search results were no longer relevant). You had to click a button to reveal the cancellation link, and it was a tiny line of grey text on a beige background.

Then, to make it better, they started calling me every day after I canceled my subscription.

I was going to recommend them to all my friends and family, but instead I did the opposite -- I told everyone to avoid them and only mentioned the negative aspects of their service.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#58

Post by sp332 » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:48 PM UTC

perspectivep wrote: post #51

ivraatiems wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh yeah, I do. The problem is that Cortana has supplanted basic search functionality. As far as I can tell, when you type a search in the Start menu you're still going through Cortana, technically (that's why she's always running even when she's turned off from listening to you). Cortana has access to a limited subset of your computer. She can't search things outside your C:\Users\[your username] directory. Regular W…

You're upset that search got rebranded to Cortana? It can definitely search your entire PC. I just typed the name of a script I have sitting on my D: drive and pressed enter and it opened it.

If I type a filename into that little search bar, it shows a few results. If I click the "My Stuff" button at the bottom, it shows me a different list. Neither list is complete. I have to open an explorer window to get a useful search bar.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#59

Post by kardos » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:49 PM UTC

acdha wrote: post #40

noxToken wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Make it open source, and the community will probably maintain it. I'm sure that if a list of sites were given, fixes for the dark patterns would be submitted regularly.

> Make it open source, and the community will probably maintain it … or fill the issue tracker with troubleshooting requests, demands that someone else code something they think needs to exist, long rants about whether something should or should not be included, etc. Open source maintenance is far from free.

You don't have to be a BDFL, you can delegate maintenance work to community recruits as it scales up.

Re: Dark Patterns are designed to confuse and enroll

#60

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jul 28, 2016, 3:49 PM UTC

lpolovets wrote: post #46

wldcordeiro wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, AllTrails recently went with a dark-pattern, want to see any info on the trail? Sign-up. If you don't you'll get a brief flash of the detail page before redirecting to a sign-up form.

Is that a dark pattern, or poor ux?

[deleted]