Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf] • Hacker News Board

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#61

Post by thenomad » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 3:54 PM UTC

ck425 wrote: post #33

dpweb wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't it make sense to just pay everyone (in the same type of role) essentially the same amount and then bonus people from time to time on particular outstanding achievements. Nothing is a more powerful inducement than financial incentives and a bonus gives an impact that the ongoing salary doesn't. People don't give a crap about annual reviews unless they think its low enough to get them fired. My sense is perfor…

'Nothing is a more powerful inducement than financial incentives' Actually there's a lot of research that contradicts this. Essentially as long as people have enough money that they don't worry about money ie a comfortable middle class lifestyle for country/area, and they don't think they earn significantly less that their peers, money is very inefficient and occasionally negative incentive for tasks that require a d…

IIRC Peopleware showed that financial bonuses were tremendously effective - at reducing peoples' investment in their work.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#62

Post by demonshreder » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:00 PM UTC

ixtli wrote: post #41

I think anyone who likes what they see here needs to honestly ask themselves how they believe this applies to their world. Whenever this PDF is posted on HN I am disappointed to see comparisons between how people perceive Valve and their own companies. Does your company have a total equity > 2 billion us dollars? Probably not. Much of this flows from the ability to invest in an incentivize your employees at this leve…

> As another aside I do not think there is causal evidence that Valve became successful because of these ideals. On the contrary they seem like the result of success.

In the following link, Gabe Newell explains some of ideas behind how Valve works. He argues that the way Valve works has been a conscious decision based on his experiences while working at Microsoft and interacting with other companies at that time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8QEOBgLBQU

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#63

Post by Sebguer » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:01 PM UTC

wishinghand wrote: post #43

danso wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[insert obligatory Half-Life 3 joke/reference here] I've never used Steam's customer support; do they outsource any of it to contractors and/or offshore?

They've tried and they discontinued doing so because they felt it was even worse than being apathetic about it.

What's your source on that? I'm fairly certain that all of Valve's customer support is outsourced, though not specifically overseas, but to contract support teams.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#64

Post by trevyn » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:01 PM UTC

maho wrote: post #29

We value “T-shaped” people. That is, people who are both generalists (highly skilled at a broad set of valuable things—the top of the T) and also experts (among the best in their field within a narrow discipline -- the vertical leg of the T). This is a nice metaphor. I try to be T-shaped, but I wonder how useful I am becoming... My expertise in high-precision mass spectrometry is not something companies are looking f…

It is also important to intelligently select where your vertical leg is placed.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#65

Post by localhost » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:05 PM UTC

sebastianbk wrote: post #11

As a Microsoft employee I am so happy that we got rid of stack ranking a few years ago. It encourages a bad behavior and goes against helping your coworkers with whom you are essentially competing for compensation. I am surprised to see that a company like Valve, which seems to be held in high regard by many developers in the industry, still operates with this compensation system. It's system of the 80's if you ask m…

At any company (Microsoft included) where performance-based compensation exists, there is a budget for that line item. Therefore it is a zero-sum game - to pay someone more because of their performance, that means that someone else gets less (or zero) from that line item.

So, depending on how you interpret the term "stack ranking", you can either look at it as "forced removal of the bottom x% of the company" or "people aren't ranked / bucketized". In the MSFT case, I believe that the former has been removed. But the latter definitely cannot be removed if you are to have performance-based compensation.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#66

Post by usrusr » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:06 PM UTC

dpweb wrote: post #21

sebastianbk wrote: post #11

As a Microsoft employee I am so happy that we got rid of stack ranking a few years ago. It encourages a bad behavior and goes against helping your coworkers with whom you are essentially competing for compensation. I am surprised to see that a company like Valve, which seems to be held in high regard by many developers in the industry, still operates with this compensation system. It's system of the 80's if you ask m…

Wouldn't it make sense to just pay everyone (in the same type of role) essentially the same amount and then bonus people from time to time on particular outstanding achievements. Nothing is a more powerful inducement than financial incentives and a bonus gives an impact that the ongoing salary doesn't. People don't give a crap about annual reviews unless they think its low enough to get them fired. My sense is perfor…

Extra money for excellence comes with an implied message that the regular money is just for showing up. You really don't want your employees to feel that way.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#67

Post by tassl » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:06 PM UTC

dlss wrote: post #55

nxzero wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cults focus on "we/us/them" not you doing what you feel is best for you.

In my experience a tremendous amount of religious teaching focuses on self-improvement (avoiding sin, cleansing of past sins, etc, etc). I do agree that the USA isn't a cult though. Too big/diverse.

"Avoid sin" and "cleansing" does not always goes together with self-improvement, but it usually goes tight with regret. I would have agreed with you if you used self-control as self-improvement.

Plus... the concept of sin depends on the religion.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#68

Post by chriswwweb » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:15 PM UTC

kuharich wrote: post #4

Previous discussions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3871463 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8818893 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9250527

Year over year over year somebody posts a link to this PDF since 2012 ... source: https://hn.algolia.com/?query=Valve%20Handbook&sort=byPopula...

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#69

Post by matthewowen » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:20 PM UTC

oblio wrote: post #20

Thaxll wrote: post #16

From what I heard from ex employee working at Valve it's not what you think it is. i.e: it's very political.

Any group of more than 2 people is always "political" :) There's a reason all Olympic sports where you can interact with your opponents only have 2 teams/opponents facing off at the same time.

On the face of it, this seems like a reasonable comment. But it has basically no relationship to reality:

    Many track cycling events
    Road cycling
    Every track event
    Marathon
    Marathon swimming
    Triathlon
    Sailing

This is a non-exhaustive list off the top of my head. They all involve tactical interaction with a group of opponents.

Re: Valve – Handbook for New Employees (2012) [pdf]

#70

Post by donatj » Mon, Jul 25, 2016, 4:27 PM UTC

whatever_dude wrote: post #50

MIKarlsen wrote: post #37

I find the whole "You are a person who spend every waking hour optimizing yourself to become the best YOU you can be"-frame of mind very intimidating. Maybe it's because I'm not american, but even though I like to work with complex issues, I also like a 9-17 job with a decent income, and the ability to go home and relax when I'm not working. And by relax, I don't mean working on side projects, doing volunteer work or…

You're right - it's very much an American thing. Maybe not exclusive to the US, and it may vary by state or background, but still very common there from my experience with family and friends. In American culture, unless you're financially constrained, you grow up with someone hammering down the idea that you have to be doing something productive and getting better 100% of the time. If you're a kid, you have to be inv…

American here. I don't interpret it that way. I strongly desire to always be growing as a person yet I find quiet reflection some of my most valuable time. I don't think they're mutually exclusive.