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Create React Apps with No Configuration

facebook.github.io

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Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#181

Post by rattray »

danabramov wrote: post #94
afarrell wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lack of testing is a pretty big oversight given how helpful testing is for someone getting started. Hopefully it is easy to just add mocha on top of this with out any mucking around?

It shouldn’t be too hard. This is not an oversight, we literally developed this project in a single week. We plan to add testing, just need to decide on the runner and good defaults: https://github.com/facebookincubator/create-react-app/issues... .

I really would love to see all the "features" listed above (and more) as a part of this tool.

eg; `create-react-app --hot --less`

Including commonly-used defaults first, and adding full community bundling later, would be much appreciated. There are probably Good luck with this project and thanks a ton for dreaming it up & getting it out the door!

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#182

Post by Bahamut »

This is great! Toolchain pain really sucks, and makes being able to get started on a project harder for many, when all you want to do is get a setup running and start creating app code. Having an opinionated CLI start up a scaffold is great - one can also peel apart this whenever one has to prepare for modifying the build chain for specific purposes (for example using Rollup to optimize bundled code, adding new build steps, etc.).

The only thing I disagree with here is not allowing it to be pluggable - IMO it should be flexible and allow users to tweak the setup as desired. Of course, it should focus on getting the core experience right, but in the long term I absolutely think it would be better to have a pluggable CLI.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#183

Post by andrewstuart »

Bahamut wrote: post #182

This is great! Toolchain pain really sucks, and makes being able to get started on a project harder for many, when all you want to do is get a setup running and start creating app code. Having an opinionated CLI start up a scaffold is great - one can also peel apart this whenever one has to prepare for modifying the build chain for specific purposes (for example using Rollup to optimize bundled code, adding new build…

Toolchain pain is closely related to configurability i.e. "having a pluggable API".

Your choices for this type of tool are zero configuration with no pain, or configurability with pain.

You can't have it both ways. In the JavaScript world, configuration and pain are synonyms.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#184

Post by Bahamut »

andrewstuart wrote: post #183
Bahamut wrote: post #182

This is great! Toolchain pain really sucks, and makes being able to get started on a project harder for many, when all you want to do is get a setup running and start creating app code. Having an opinionated CLI start up a scaffold is great - one can also peel apart this whenever one has to prepare for modifying the build chain for specific purposes (for example using Rollup to optimize bundled code, adding new build…

Toolchain pain is closely related to configurability i.e. "having a pluggable API". Your choices for this type of tool are zero configuration with no pain, or configurability with pain. You can't have it both ways. In the JavaScript world, configuration and pain are synonyms.

> In the JavaScript world, configuration and pain are synonyms.

This is outright false. There is some relation, but not all configuration results in pain.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#185

Post by insin »

sotojuan wrote: post #142
_____s wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another great thing about ember-cli is that it has very quickly build around it a great community [1]. There are a lot of high quality, well tested addons that are easy to install and use, and it's easy to create your own as well. [1]: https://emberobserver.com/

The best part about ember-cli is that everyone in the Ember community uses it. No one builds Ember apps without it. The opposite is true of any community/third party React CLI and it's a very powerful difference.

I'd say Webpack plays that role in the React community, just without a blessed and shared way to configure it.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#186

Post by andrewstuart »

Bahamut wrote: post #184
andrewstuart wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Toolchain pain is closely related to configurability i.e. "having a pluggable API". Your choices for this type of tool are zero configuration with no pain, or configurability with pain. You can't have it both ways. In the JavaScript world, configuration and pain are synonyms.

> In the JavaScript world, configuration and pain are synonyms. This is outright false. There is some relation, but not all configuration results in pain.

It's a good enough slogan.... if more developers took it to heart then JavaScript development would not be the torturous process it is today.

Any time anyone thinks about adding a configuration option they should think again and if humanly possible, take the configuration option out.

Developers love making things configurable - it's a way of avoiding tough decisions about what software should and should not be able to do.

The best developers are constantly looking for opportunities to remove configurability without compromising the goals of their software.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#187

Post by Bahamut »

andrewstuart wrote: post #186
Bahamut wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In the JavaScript world, configuration and pain are synonyms. This is outright false. There is some relation, but not all configuration results in pain.

It's a good enough slogan.... if more developers took it to heart then JavaScript development would not be the torturous process it is today. Any time anyone thinks about adding a configuration option they should think again and if humanly possible, take the configuration option out. Developers love making things configurable - it's a way of avoiding tough decisions about what software should and should not be able t…

If it's wrong, it's not good enough.

I don't disagree that configuration is awful, especially if it isn't well thought out, but some configuration is unavoidable & even preferable in some situations (for example when dealing with differences between production, qa, and dev environments). Dismissing configuration wholesale though is laziness. All things should be considered carefully, and blanket statements serve little good.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#188

Post by anthonybullard »

danabramov wrote: post #120
lacker wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're using create-react-app then you're encouraged to use ES6 classes - that's how the default App.js is set up.

>However I do wish the React team would pick between ES6 classes and `React.createClass` We’re going with ES6 classes. Expect createClass() to go into another package some time this year. (Obviously we’ll provide an automated “codemod” utility to convert your existing code.)

Please say it isn't so! Class is terrible syntactic sugar to please old Java programmers. I'd be really interested in why this decision would be made. Im just getting going in React and am looking to make a move away from Angular, because Angular 2 is so hyper focused on classes and decorators. I like React because it's closer on the purity scale to something like Cycle.js.

But nevermind me, React is a great tool, and this is a very nice and needed project!

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#189

Post by kerkeslager »

orf wrote: post #25

> Having just attended EmberCamp a week ago, I was excited about Ember CLI. Ember users have a great “getting started” experience thanks to a curated set of tools united under a single command-line interface. This is one of the best things about Ember. `ember new`, `ember serve`, ember generate component my-component`, `ember build`, `ember deploy`, `ember install`. It's opinionated but it lets you get productive rig…

Having used Ember and React, this was my experience too. Ember lets you get up and running really fast. However, once you start doing anything outside of something it doesn't have an opinion about, you're stuck working around the framework. Good luck with that.

At the end of last summer we started to make the migration from Ember to React, and we removed the last Ember code from our code base in April of this year. It has been a slow process, but it has paid off immensely in productivity. I'd rather write code to solve all my problems than have a solution that solves 90% of my problems out of the box but then makes solving the remaining 10% a hacky, unpredictable process.

Re: Create React Apps with No Configuration

#190

Post by gavinpc »

kerkeslager wrote: post #189
orf wrote: post #25

> Having just attended EmberCamp a week ago, I was excited about Ember CLI. Ember users have a great “getting started” experience thanks to a curated set of tools united under a single command-line interface. This is one of the best things about Ember. `ember new`, `ember serve`, ember generate component my-component`, `ember build`, `ember deploy`, `ember install`. It's opinionated but it lets you get productive rig…

Having used Ember and React, this was my experience too. Ember lets you get up and running really fast. However, once you start doing anything outside of something it doesn't have an opinion about, you're stuck working around the framework. Good luck with that. At the end of last summer we started to make the migration from Ember to React, and we removed the last Ember code from our code base in April of this year. I…

> I'd rather write code to solve all my problems than have a solution that solves 90% of my problems out of the box but then makes solving the remaining 10% a hacky, unpredictable process.

So are you saying that, absent a better framework than Ember, you would have recommended migrating to no framework at all?

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