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How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

theatlantic.com

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Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#31

Post by markc »

fit2rule wrote: post #30
Iv wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One doesn't need to lie over stories to make them inspirational.

Where is the lie? There isn't anything un-true about the title. More to the point, the inspirational aspect of the story is quite worthwhile. You might say the "trailer-park" inspiration is one aspect, the "we don't know everything we think we do, even 150 years later" angle is another aspect, and there is a third, possibly overlooked facet, which is that this opens up immense new opportunities for understanding life…

>There isn't anything un-true about the title.

That's true from a literal standpoint, however the title misleads many people into expecting that the subject isn't just from a trailer park as part of his past, but that he somehow made the breakthrough as a current, stereotypical, trailer park resident, i.e. not highly educated.

If there was an intention to mislead it is a lie.

If it's unintentional, it's just poor headline writing (ambiguous and easily misleading).

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#32

Post by jessaustin »

smt88 wrote: post #27

Did he create opportunities for himself, or did he live in a country where other taxpayers covered the cost of his college education? He's an impressive person, but "poor guy pulled himself up by the bootstraps using sheer force of will" narratives usually fall apart when you look more closely.

Do we really need this political bullshit here? Dude made a discovery, let's not pick it apart for bizarre partisan reasons.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#33

Post by Practicality »

thieving_magpie wrote: post #18

I lived in Montana for years. The only population of folks that speak German that I'm aware of are Hutterites (German variation of the Amish or Mennonites). If he comes from that group, it makes the story all the more amazing.

Thank you. I was trying to deduce which religion he was referring to but there was not enough information in the article.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#34

Post by randomdata »

Semiapies wrote: post #29
randomdata wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the classism in question really about being poor? From my perspective, it is about perpetuating the stereotype that rural people are 'slack jawed yokels'. If this guy was from a vertical trailer park (i.e. a high rise condo unit), we wouldn't think twice about it because, despite being potentially just as poor, he is an 'enlightened city dweller'.

There's a rural vs urban component, but yes, it's about being poor. If he were poor and urban, a similar article would have talked about him growing up in the "mean streets" of some poor neighborhood. It's the same reaction.

Perhaps it's a regional thing then, because where I come from, trailer parks are essentially cottages for the middle class. The poor connotation isn't there, but the lack of population density certainly is.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#35

Post by hinkley »

lumberjack wrote: post #12
xkcd-sucks wrote: post #4

Could we change the title to something a little less clickbaity/classist? Even though it's the title of the actual article, trailer parks have nothing to do do with the actual content.

Not going to touch on whether it is relevant to the rest of the article but acknowledging classism is the opposite of being classist.

Try an experiment. Replace the adjective in question with a race that you feel is being maligned. Does the sentence now make you cringe? Then it is probably classist,

I think the people who point out this sort of thing are usually just trying to illustrate that there's all these gossipy judgements we make of each other and that it happens so often and so consistently that we end up doing it it thoughtlessly.

And then there are the people who think the rags to riches tale is just one of the tools of the rich and powerful. That the token success story keeps the rest of us from doing anything to change the status quo. And so rather than being inspired by them they just get grumpy.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#36

Post by smt88 »

jessaustin wrote: post #32
smt88 wrote: post #27

Did he create opportunities for himself, or did he live in a country where other taxpayers covered the cost of his college education? He's an impressive person, but "poor guy pulled himself up by the bootstraps using sheer force of will" narratives usually fall apart when you look more closely.

Do we really need this political bullshit here? Dude made a discovery, let's not pick it apart for bizarre partisan reasons.

Politics is inextricable from human life, news, and technology. Any story here can be political, and that should be fine. Whatever my political leanings, I had an issue with this sentence:

> creating opportunities for yourself where none seem to exist

The fact is that there were opportunities. In countries where education is free and accessible, there are always opportunities.

If the subject is spreading education, I will happily be partisan and political, even if you find it irritating. It's too important to ignore, especially when it's a core factor in this headline and story.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#37

Post by fit2rule »

markc wrote: post #31
fit2rule wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the lie? There isn't anything un-true about the title. More to the point, the inspirational aspect of the story is quite worthwhile. You might say the "trailer-park" inspiration is one aspect, the "we don't know everything we think we do, even 150 years later" angle is another aspect, and there is a third, possibly overlooked facet, which is that this opens up immense new opportunities for understanding life…

>There isn't anything un-true about the title. That's true from a literal standpoint, however the title misleads many people into expecting that the subject isn't just from a trailer park as part of his past, but that he somehow made the breakthrough as a current, stereotypical, trailer park resident, i.e. not highly educated. If there was an intention to mislead it is a lie. If it's unintentional, it's just poor hea…

You really are missing the point of the headline, which purpose is to attract readers to a subject they wouldn't otherwise be interested in.. and the fact that "even a kid from a trailerpark can up-end cemented thinking in science" is very relevant. It does, in fact, change everything: the scientists' class and social background is not relevant to the science he or she performs, but the fact of extraordinary science being performed by extraordinary individuals is relevant. Maybe there was something in his trailerpark lifestyle that made him start to think differently about the things he'd learned about as a scientist; you, the reader, are invited to make your own conclusions before you walk away. The title is a part of that process.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#38

Post by goodcanadian »

whack wrote: post #8

The headline makes it seem as though some guy overturned a fundamental precept of modern biology, while living in a Trailer in Montana. None of the above is true. 1) He happened to grow up in a trailer in Montana, but eventually moved on to attend a good German university, and was no longer living in a "Montana trailer park" while making this discovery. 2) The guy corrected a misunderstanding that people had, regardi…

I did not read this article, but I read a different one a couple of days ago. The headline should be "Researcher from University of Montana overturns 150 years of understanding of lichens" or some such. It is still a (really) big deal, but that title is so link-baity it is absolutely disgusting.

EDIT:

Lichens aren't quite what we thought, shocked scientists discover

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/technology/lichen-yeast-1.368946...

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#39

Post by whack »

safeignorance wrote: post #14
whack wrote: post #8

The headline makes it seem as though some guy overturned a fundamental precept of modern biology, while living in a Trailer in Montana. None of the above is true. 1) He happened to grow up in a trailer in Montana, but eventually moved on to attend a good German university, and was no longer living in a "Montana trailer park" while making this discovery. 2) The guy corrected a misunderstanding that people had, regardi…

Of course, the guy's life story is still an inspirational tale of creating opportunities for yourself where none seem to exist. And his discovery -- although probably not rocking the foundation of the (sub)field -- is still impressive and pretty interesting. And the article is written well enough. So you should still read the article. Just pretend the link-baity title doesn't exist and don't go in with pre-conception…

I agree. The article was a cool read and props to the guy for successfully building a career in science, despite his shitty upbringing. I just wish the headline didn't wildly exaggerate his admirable accomplishments.

Re: How Toby Spribille Overturned 150 Years of Biology about Lichens

#40

Post by ogig »

whack wrote: post #8

The headline makes it seem as though some guy overturned a fundamental precept of modern biology, while living in a Trailer in Montana. None of the above is true. 1) He happened to grow up in a trailer in Montana, but eventually moved on to attend a good German university, and was no longer living in a "Montana trailer park" while making this discovery. 2) The guy corrected a misunderstanding that people had, regardi…

> The specific makeup of Lichens though, is an extremely niche field, that doesn't affect the broader field of Biology in any significant way.

The article mentions how the symbiotic relationship discovered in 1868 cleared the way to our better, broader understanding of other ecological systems. I can see how the current discovery could lead to some deeper knowledge. Maybe it hints at how complex living things appear. Maybe we understimated this processess and they deserve more eyes on it.

I agree with the trailer thing on the title, no need.

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