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Reddit is still in turmoil

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Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#261

Post by carsick_alastor »

jules wrote: post #236
rmc wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"right wing" or "far right wing". Remember we're talking about literal neo-nazis here, not just Conservatives.

That's not how it goes in practice. The fact that the people in that twitter thread endorse antifa shows that they are either ignorant of what antifa actually is (as opposed to what it claims to be), or they endorse an organisation that is more fascist than the fascists it purports to fight.

Antifa is a label, typically self-appointed. There must be thousands, probably tens of thousands of groups that identify as antifa, most of them confined to a region or a city.

It's possible to make generalisations across all the various groups, but you're going to have huge variance across them -- in pretty much all areas, including internal structure, attitude towards violence and political positions.

Of course groups are aware of one another and cooperate (as well as conflict, I assume) in an anarchic way, but there is no centralized power or executive. It's certainly not a single organisation.

From an organisational perspective, sports fan clubs are rather similar (mostly independent of one another, mostly local, very heterogeneous in how they work internally and interact with the world).

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#262

Post by [deleted] »

twblalock wrote: post #6

I think much of Reddit's problems with its userbase boil down to an early failure to manage expectations. It's pretty clear that the Reddit corporation doesn't want Reddit to be an anything-goes, absolute free speech zone with no moderation or anti-harassment policies -- but that's what the site actually was for many years. Now, when the company cracks down, users think their freedoms are being curtailed. The mistake…

[deleted]

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#263

Post by jules »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #252
jules wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how it goes in practice. The fact that the people in that twitter thread endorse antifa shows that they are either ignorant of what antifa actually is (as opposed to what it claims to be), or they endorse an organisation that is more fascist than the fascists it purports to fight.

“The anti-fascists are the real fascists!” is a tired argument and it has been for more than 70 years, ever since that was said in actual Nazi Germany and the fascists proceeded to win.

When the so called anti-fascists use violence against peaceful protesters and against the police who try to stop them, then yes.

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#264

Post by intoverflow2 »

jfoutz wrote: post #10
matwood wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have beer in the fridge and a keg at work. Sometimes it's nice to have a beer at the end of the day, but after a working all day I usually just want to go home.

Yeah, i can see that. Finish a big project and have a beer with your team. I have a hard time seeing that as a daily or even weekly thing.

Much more common in the creative industries.

In advertising for example it's not uncommon for creative teams to head off to the pub for a brainstorm in the afternoon if its thursday/friday.

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#265

Post by k__ »

twblalock wrote: post #6

I think much of Reddit's problems with its userbase boil down to an early failure to manage expectations. It's pretty clear that the Reddit corporation doesn't want Reddit to be an anything-goes, absolute free speech zone with no moderation or anti-harassment policies -- but that's what the site actually was for many years. Now, when the company cracks down, users think their freedoms are being curtailed. The mistake…

They want to have the cake and eat it.

I saw this so many times.

First they make it free for all everything goes, then people come and use it and then they start moderation/cencorship to the max.

Wikipedia, Stackoverflow, Reddit, etc.

It's totally normal and okay for users to feel cheated, because they WERE cheated...

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#266

Post by sbmassey »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #252
jules wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how it goes in practice. The fact that the people in that twitter thread endorse antifa shows that they are either ignorant of what antifa actually is (as opposed to what it claims to be), or they endorse an organisation that is more fascist than the fascists it purports to fight.

“The anti-fascists are the real fascists!” is a tired argument and it has been for more than 70 years, ever since that was said in actual Nazi Germany and the fascists proceeded to win.

Did anyone in Nazi Germany really claim that the anti-Nazis were the real Nazis or fascists or something? Sounds unlikely somehow.

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#267

Post by jules »

carsick_alastor wrote: post #261
jules wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how it goes in practice. The fact that the people in that twitter thread endorse antifa shows that they are either ignorant of what antifa actually is (as opposed to what it claims to be), or they endorse an organisation that is more fascist than the fascists it purports to fight.

Antifa is a label, typically self-appointed. There must be thousands, probably tens of thousands of groups that identify as antifa, most of them confined to a region or a city. It's possible to make generalisations across all the various groups, but you're going to have huge variance across them -- in pretty much all areas, including internal structure, attitude towards violence and political positions. Of course gro…

One only has to look at that twitter thread to see what kind of antifa they are endorsing:

> we have an "antifa" movement in France (reacting to our rising far right), and they're often just as violent :-(

reply:

> yup, 100% okay with that, personally

> Me too (mostly). Personally trying to flush out internalised cishet machismo, but if there was ever an outlet...

> the only things fascists respond to is violence. Ignoring them or letting them attack you doesn't help

> good! bash their brains in tbh

It is clear that the kind of antifa they are endorsing falls on a particular point on the "huge variance" spectrum of attitude to violence. It is clear that the code of conduct is being applied selectively to one half of the political spectrum. And I say this as somebody who has always voted for the most left wing party in my country. This attitude towards violence and censorship and social shaming from my side worries me greatly.

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#268

Post by Iv »

RubyPinch wrote: post #254
Iv wrote: post #113

Here is a good time to repost a paragraph about why one should not trust Reddit, by Reddit's then CEO, Yishan Wong: > I am continually astounded that people sort of trust corporations like they trust people. We can talk all day about how the current team is trustworthy and we're not in the business of screwing you, but I also have to say that you can never predict what happens. reddit could be subject to some kind of…

isn't that more "don't trust any company"? what he says applies to way more than reddit

Well, yes. His main point is to not trust reddit because it is a company.

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#269

Post by gkya »

Iv wrote: post #113

Here is a good time to repost a paragraph about why one should not trust Reddit, by Reddit's then CEO, Yishan Wong: > I am continually astounded that people sort of trust corporations like they trust people. We can talk all day about how the current team is trustworthy and we're not in the business of screwing you, but I also have to say that you can never predict what happens. reddit could be subject to some kind of…

This is true for anything. People hit their heads somewhere and their character change.

Re: Reddit is still in turmoil

#270

Post by pferde »

phyzome wrote: post #117
minimaxir wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self-promotion aside, you should disclose that you are ex-Reddit.

To be fair, kickme444 was pretty well-known as a reddit employee! (But explicit disclosure is good too.)

Some of us rarely ever look at the username behind (above) a comment. I personally just don't care, if the content is interesting.

And even if I did, there is just too many users, across various discussion sites, to keep all the pseudonyms and their comment history in one's head.

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