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How to be a wizard programmer

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Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#11

Post by JoshTriplett »

tubs wrote: post #6

Until the more senior member quits because they are wasting the vast majority of their time answering questions that could have been answered by just trying for more than 30seconds after hitting an obstacle...

You're demonstrating why people become afraid to ask questions, and stop doing so even when they should.

I'd much rather have someone ask when they get stuck, or even if they're kinda stuck. If someone happens to ask me a question that's easily found via poking around a bit more, I'll show them how they could have found the answer, and then they'll have learned two things: the thing they wanted to know and a new pattern for solving problems.

As a result, I rapidly find myself surrounded by people who ask smarter and smarter questions, and who can solve harder and harder problems. And I love that result.

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#12

Post by JoshTriplett »

zamalek wrote: post #10
dozzie wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not after twentieth question of similar construction and similarly easy to be answered by the one who asked if he actually read the friggin' docs. Seniors like to help learn, not to be used as a walking manual.

When it's the first hit on Google you start feeling as though you are doing other peoples' work for them. Luckily I now have a fantastic manager: she aggressively defends the time of all her team members. Being a wizard developer also requires a wizard manager that the developers can trust completely.

While I do sometimes have people ask questions that I can easily find the answer to, I rarely have people ask questions that they can easily find the answer to. Sometimes, it's the first search result for a term they didn't happen to know, for instance, and mentioning that term helps them. (Also consider the concepts of "inferential distance" and "illusion of transparency".)

And even the concept of "search for the error message" is a pattern someone needs to learn, once. Ideally it's one they'd learn very early on when learning. But I've found that very few people talk about or provide guidance in the processes of learning themselves. Which is why I'm glad that people write down advice like the page tweeted here.

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#13

Post by ricksplat »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #11
tubs wrote: post #6

Until the more senior member quits because they are wasting the vast majority of their time answering questions that could have been answered by just trying for more than 30seconds after hitting an obstacle...

You're demonstrating why people become afraid to ask questions, and stop doing so even when they should. I'd much rather have someone ask when they get stuck, or even if they're kinda stuck. If someone happens to ask me a question that's easily found via poking around a bit more, I'll show them how they could have found the answer, and then they'll have learned two things: the thing they wanted to know and a new patt…

What I would prefer, is somebody who tries to figure it out themselves, even if it takes more time ... just maybe I don't have the answers and would like somebody to give me information for a change rather than just take take take ...

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#15

Post by ricksplat »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #12
zamalek wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it's the first hit on Google you start feeling as though you are doing other peoples' work for them. Luckily I now have a fantastic manager: she aggressively defends the time of all her team members. Being a wizard developer also requires a wizard manager that the developers can trust completely.

While I do sometimes have people ask questions that I can easily find the answer to, I rarely have people ask questions that they can easily find the answer to. Sometimes, it's the first search result for a term they didn't happen to know, for instance, and mentioning that term helps them. (Also consider the concepts of "inferential distance" and "illusion of transparency".) And even the concept of "search for the er…

> it's the first search result for a term they didn't happen to know

> even the concept of "search for the error message" is a pattern someone needs to learn

I suppose if we're talking about a graduate or intern this is okay, but when you have somebody that supposedly has a few years experience this is just infuriating.

There is also the point that you shouldn't be getting a graduate/intern to be doing work they haven't the capability to google the terms of ...

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#16

Post by nul_byte »

tubs wrote: post #6

Until the more senior member quits because they are wasting the vast majority of their time answering questions that could have been answered by just trying for more than 30seconds after hitting an obstacle...

As someone senior myself, I really don't mind the easy to answer, quick questions. It's when people dump real time sinks onto me that will cause me irritation, as I then need to manage my time and realign all my own pending tasks.

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#17

Post by lubonay »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #11
tubs wrote: post #6

Until the more senior member quits because they are wasting the vast majority of their time answering questions that could have been answered by just trying for more than 30seconds after hitting an obstacle...

You're demonstrating why people become afraid to ask questions, and stop doing so even when they should. I'd much rather have someone ask when they get stuck, or even if they're kinda stuck. If someone happens to ask me a question that's easily found via poking around a bit more, I'll show them how they could have found the answer, and then they'll have learned two things: the thing they wanted to know and a new patt…

Somewhat inexperienced team leader here. IMO, working on improving the team's knowledge as a whole is so much more rewarding than working on your own knowledge and snapping at people who want you to share it.

The style I favor when the junior devs ask me questions is to ask questions right back at them, kind of like in a Socratic dialogue. This makes them reluctant to come to me for easy answers and think more about the problem first.

In the end I get a team of people with steadily improving skills to whom I can delegate ever more complex tasks.

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#18

Post by collyw »

ricksplat wrote: post #13
JoshTriplett wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're demonstrating why people become afraid to ask questions, and stop doing so even when they should. I'd much rather have someone ask when they get stuck, or even if they're kinda stuck. If someone happens to ask me a question that's easily found via poking around a bit more, I'll show them how they could have found the answer, and then they'll have learned two things: the thing they wanted to know and a new patt…

What I would prefer, is somebody who tries to figure it out themselves, even if it takes more time ... just maybe I don't have the answers and would like somebody to give me information for a change rather than just take take take ...

I think there is a balance somewhere.

Re: How to be a wizard programmer

#19

Post by Sir_Substance »

ricksplat wrote: post #15
JoshTriplett wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I do sometimes have people ask questions that I can easily find the answer to, I rarely have people ask questions that they can easily find the answer to. Sometimes, it's the first search result for a term they didn't happen to know, for instance, and mentioning that term helps them. (Also consider the concepts of "inferential distance" and "illusion of transparency".) And even the concept of "search for the er…

> it's the first search result for a term they didn't happen to know > even the concept of "search for the error message" is a pattern someone needs to learn I suppose if we're talking about a graduate or intern this is okay, but when you have somebody that supposedly has a few years experience this is just infuriating. There is also the point that you shouldn't be getting a graduate/intern to be doing work they have…

>but when you have somebody that supposedly has a few years experience this is just infuriating.

You know how sometimes programmers on Hacker news talk about toxic team mates who are hard to work with and bog the whole team down through arrogance?

Becoming furious when someone asks you a question and truly wishing they'd waste half a day deriving it from first principals themselves rather than just asking you and having an answer in 30 seconds makes you one of those toxic team mates.

Modern software development is a team game. The average speed of the team is what matters, not your personal speed.

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