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Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

asiancorrespondent.com

211–220 of 353 posts

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#211
post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we assume the same rules will be applied to the whole population? Or will it just be applied to "them"?

There is judicial process to all.

How do you get that from the article? 30 killed since June 30 and calling on people to kill addicts themselves as it would be too hard for the parents. Describing addicts mothers as whores. How does this indicate judicial process?

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#212

Not directly related to Phillipines, but an actual Bay Area addict case question...And honestly, I'm not sure of individuals current state (no arrest records)... Young female from out of area (some state) comes (homeless) to a town known for downward spirals. Arrested 20+ times over 2 years, mainly around meth addiction, but seriously mental. Local people reach out to family/friends of said individual via social medi…

Everyone is ultimately responsible for themselves. You can't help someone that doesn't want to be helped and isn't willing to take responsibility for themselves.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we assume the same rules will be applied to the whole population? Or will it just be applied to "them"?

Once you go there, it's really hard to come back.

Could you explain this further? The president's comments are straight up scary and the police actions seem to way overstep human rights.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#214
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He wasn't shot by the cops so that means he could be shot by THE BOSS, vigilante or his partner. Who knows...

> THE BOSS, vigilante or his partner. Who knows... You don't see a problem with that? How do you know he even was a drug lord (other than that conspicuous sign)?

The number of apologists for what's happening is pretty alarming. When did these sorts of things start getting justified here? It's happening with anything mentioning China too.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#215
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation. And yes, there is judicial process but people will read more if the media highlights and writes about "extrajudicial killing" instead.

> Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation. In a country where the police is as corrupt as yours the last thing you want is to by-pass due process. That pretty much guarantees that lots of opponents of the newly elected regime will suddenly find themselves on the receiving end in 'buy-bust' operations. > And yes, there is judicial process I find that hard to square with > Those related to drugs…

> Judicial process 30 killed since June 30. Things seem to move fast in those judicial circles.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#216
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Giving up liberty.." No. Liberty doesn't mean anyone has the right to harm other people. We should be encouraging more liberty, not less. We are not and should not ever be the Soviet Union. The Bolsheviks said the exact same things you are saying -- almost exactly. And no, it won't be different this time. Man is man. Suffering additional government bureaucracy? No way. It's interesting because I would bet you're opp…

[deleted]

The freedoms that you are asking for necessarily involve the coercion of other people in order to ensure them.

That's suspect to me.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#217

As usual, mostly western commentators sitting on their high horses pointing and pontificating with no idea of local context or understanding. First of all, Duterte was elected overwhelmingly with a clear mandate of using brute violence to clear out drug dealers. He was clear about it and he is delivering on that mandate. I have to accept, he has made a PR error by not calling them terrorists. At which point, he will…

No offense, but you sound like an aging white man slamming his fist on the table and hectoring "what we need is a good war!" at family dinners. Human rights, and more specifically due process, are not 'Western', they've just been formulated there. Do you believe gravity is 'white' or 'jewish' because it was formulated by Einstein? And societies that 'get' due process objectively do better: tell me, who does better in…

> You can't _claim_ guilt, you need proof, and to get proof you need due process.

You don't need it when you are at war. Killing people is normal during a wa even without evidence.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#218
post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UBI will not happen. Not because free money are not good for the people — they are. Not because everyone will suddenly get lazy and stop working — they won't. Because UBI is unsustainable and won't last more than a year. There is not enough money for any plausible scenario. That's why. And yes, let's give people "free" money and do nothing about hugely overpriced and corrupt healthcare system, education and things. I…

I upvoted you because you're right with regards to UBI as it's argued for in places like this forum. The same arguments were true the first time these ideas were proposed when it was called Social Credit. However, I suspect that replacing patchwork welfare and social programs with a simplified negative income tax[1] or expansion of the earned income tax credit is a plausible path that could lead towards something lik…

I despise bureaucracy as much as the next person, but replacing welfare programs with negative income tax will not work. There are just too many people and too little money. Welfare programs are specific and target select audience; targeting broad audience will just spread the money to wafer-thin levels.

Concerning the automation and sudden increases in productivity — but this was exactly the very same promise that full-scale Communism was expected to deliver in Soviet Union. It was reiterated in internal propaganda endlessly (I still remember that). As every ex-Soviet person knows well, the full-scale Communism (with free basic income, fully automated factories and cities of the future) was promised as early as 1980. Now it is called "post-scarcity".

It wasn't delivered then, and I doubt it will be delivered this century.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#219
A major problem is that since many of the police are involved in the drug trade it becomes open season on their adversaries. Same thing happened in Thailand when Thaksin first because prime minister and declared open war on drug dealers. There were 2,500 extra-judicial killings, many of which were retaliation for drug deals gone bad and some just revenge killings of people who weren't even involved in the drug trade. There's bound to be a lot of the same thing in the Philippines.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was clear with his methods BEFORE electios https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/may/09/philippines-el... Not the usual bait and switch. Like was pointed out, drug dealers are free to surrender. And some have done so. http://news.abs-cbn.com/news/07/09/16/thousands-of-drug-push... My own gripe is pontification of the west when it comes to the business of other countries.

"Like was pointed out, drug dealers are free to surrender. And some have done so." How is this an answer to preventing the worse of what currently is? The extrajudicial killings in the name of wiping out the drug problem can (and I presume that it also will) be abused to whatever means. If murder was present before, this president just made it a whole lot easier! "Killed? Oh, well! Probably just another bunch of drug…

Also some of the drug dealers have surrendered and been killed anyway http://news.abs-cbn.com/news/07/09/16/oplan-tokhang-surrende...
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