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Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

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Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#11

Post by snuxoll »

cmotzakut6 wrote: post #8
danhak wrote: post #2

From the Article: > The driver in Montana was headed from Seattle to Yellowstone National Park when he crashed on a two-lane highway near Cardwell. ..."It's a winding road going through a canyon, with no shoulder" From the Tesla Owners Manual: > Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is primarily intended for driving on dry, straight roads, such as highways and freeways. ... > Autosteer is particularly unlikely to operate as i…

Can autopilot not tell a straight road from a curvy road? If it can, why does it apply throttle when it detects that it is driving in a type of road it cannot handle?

A driver is still supposed to remain alert and have their hands on the wheel, this allows Tesla to collect telemetry on autopilot so it CAN work on improving the software to handle these conditions better. I think the flaw here is the hands-on requirement is much more lenient than it should be, if it allowed the driver to keep their hands off for two full minutes (it is supposed to slow down if a driver isn't keeping their hands on the wheel) then I'd say that's a very poor design choice.

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#12

Post by readams »

taneq wrote: post #5

> "As road conditions became increasingly uncertain, the vehicle again alerted the driver to put his hands on the wheel," said Tesla. "He did not do so and shortly thereafter the vehicle collided with a post on the edge of the roadway." If the autopilot's confidence was dropping that rapidly, why did it not slow the vehicle? If it hits zero confidence it should halt completely until the driver restarts the car in man…

I think you'll find suddenly braking in the middle of the road poses its own dangers.

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#13

Post by itg »

kilroy123 wrote: post #3

I hate to say it, but there are going to be some deaths on the road to full autonomous cars. (no pun intended) The problem I see is, Tesla is the only one actively testing autonomous driving. The fact that over 100 million miles driven, and we're finally starting to see accidents, is a good sign.

Or you can test the cars the way Google does, without involving the public and having deaths on your hand from overhyping your product.

https://www.google.com/selfdrivingcar/reports/

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#14

Post by cloakandswagger »

> "No force was detected on the steering wheel for over two minutes after autosteer was engaged," said Tesla, which added that it can detect even a very small amount of force, such as one hand resting on the wheel."

Why doesn't the "autopilot" turn off if no hands are detected on the wheel?

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#15

Post by toomuchtodo »

readams wrote: post #12
taneq wrote: post #5

> "As road conditions became increasingly uncertain, the vehicle again alerted the driver to put his hands on the wheel," said Tesla. "He did not do so and shortly thereafter the vehicle collided with a post on the edge of the roadway." If the autopilot's confidence was dropping that rapidly, why did it not slow the vehicle? If it hits zero confidence it should halt completely until the driver restarts the car in man…

I think you'll find suddenly braking in the middle of the road poses its own dangers.

Agreed, but Tesla might need to get more aggressive now ("Confidence lost, resume control, emergency braking") and have the tail lights go to 100% brightness before braking is applied (to give the driver behind them ample time to slow).

The clue stick comes in many forms.

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#16

Post by Bromskloss »

the_common_man wrote: post #7

Nobody reads manuals and follows instructions . I feel Tesla is going to learn this lesson that hard way. From the article: "We specifically advise against its use at high speeds on undivided roads," it said. Tesla states clearly in its owner's manual that drivers should stay alert and keep their hands on the wheel to avoid accidents when the Autopilot feature is engaged.

> drivers should stay alert and keep their hands on the wheel

What is then the point of having an autopilot?

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#17

Post by dekhn »

kilroy123 wrote: post #3

I hate to say it, but there are going to be some deaths on the road to full autonomous cars. (no pun intended) The problem I see is, Tesla is the only one actively testing autonomous driving. The fact that over 100 million miles driven, and we're finally starting to see accidents, is a good sign.

High end cars from a few manufacturers have a significant fraction of Tesla's features, they're getting plenty of test mileage. tesla's feature set is still level 2, though- at the high end of level 2.

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#18

Post by adt2bt »

cloakandswagger wrote: post #14

> "No force was detected on the steering wheel for over two minutes after autosteer was engaged," said Tesla, which added that it can detect even a very small amount of force, such as one hand resting on the wheel." Why doesn't the "autopilot" turn off if no hands are detected on the wheel?

AFAIK it's a 'feature' of Tesla's autopilot vs other competitors which require hands on the wheel.

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#19

Post by dragonwriter »

kilroy123 wrote: post #3

I hate to say it, but there are going to be some deaths on the road to full autonomous cars. (no pun intended) The problem I see is, Tesla is the only one actively testing autonomous driving. The fact that over 100 million miles driven, and we're finally starting to see accidents, is a good sign.

> The problem I see is, Tesla is the only one actively testing autonomous driving.

No, they aren't.

They may be the only ones using consumer-operated vehicles as their test platform for the particular degree of automation that they are testing, but there may be very good, safety-related reasons why other people aren't doing that.

Re: Tesla confirms “Autopilot” crash in Montana

#20

Post by turbohedgehog »

cloakandswagger wrote: post #14

> "No force was detected on the steering wheel for over two minutes after autosteer was engaged," said Tesla, which added that it can detect even a very small amount of force, such as one hand resting on the wheel." Why doesn't the "autopilot" turn off if no hands are detected on the wheel?

Maybe the driver is medically incapacitated?
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