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Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

economist.com

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Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#141

Post by tonyedgecombe »

ZenoArrow wrote: post #136
tonyedgecombe wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what your seeing, the Tories weren't plotting against their leader whereas Labour were and still are, no journalist can ignore that.

At the time of those videos, the Labour leadership coup wasn't in full effect, the questions instead were focused on hammering on the 'unelectable' narrative the BBC and other mainstream media outlets have been aiming at Corbyn since he got in the leadership race. Contrast this with the softball questions that Cameron was getting. Worth remembering there's plenty of controversial decisions that the Conservatives made…

Or perhaps Corbyn genuinely is unelectable.

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#142

Post by oarsinsync »

cdavid wrote: post #57
fibo wrote: post #45

the big problem in Italy are taxes, I pay 38%, but for more than 55k you pay 41%, how politicians pretend Italy can survive? In Switzerland you pay 16%.

I really doubt you only pay 16 % of taxes in Switzerland. When talking about taxes, especially comparing between countries, you need to be very careful about what you are talking about. FWIW, income taxes are 40 % for income above ~32k, and the UK are not considered heavily taxed in Europe.

That's actually 40% marginal tax on income over £43,000, not £32,000, if you earn under £100,000. It's only 40% from £32,000 if you earn over £122,000.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/rates-and-allowan...

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#143

Post by calibraxis »

visarga wrote: post #74
sievebrain wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no intellectual dishonesty. Fixing the Eurozone's banking problems (assuming you believe those regulations would do the trick) is not the UK's problem and it's not the UK that blindly insists on a one-track, one-speed Europe: it's Germany and France that are wedded to that concept. They could easily have introduced new rules only in the countries that wanted them. But regardless, the problem in Italy is simp…

> Banks make loans, that's kind of what they do, How naive. Banks have to take collateral and give loans only to people/companies that have good track record. What they did is to give loans to people who could not pay back, which is a fatal mistake for a bank.

If you can get a country to likely bail you out, then "risky" loans are no-brainers. Because you externalize risks onto taxpayers.

Example: why does Obama get heavy support from the finance industry?

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#144

Post by glenndebacker »

throwaway991132 wrote: post #77
glenndebacker wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The Euro just seems like a complete failure. Giant economies are limping along with 20% unemployment, unable to recover 8 years after the recession. In contrast the US has managed an OK recovery, now closing in on full employment." You are aware that the problem with the EU banking reforms (or lack off) was also that the UK didn't wanted stricter rules with regards of the city of London... ? They even wanted an exem…

So what you are saying, is that the problems in Greece are down to the UK? I think you may want to rethink how you perceive your world. The UK has nothing to do with reforms concerning the EURO. That's up to France and Germany and the EU Central Bank. The biggest problem is this. The UK is now leaving and taking a pretty big economy with it. Those payments the UK makes is going too. The Germany Economy can't keep bai…

"So what you are saying, is that the problems in Greece are down to the UK? "

The problems in Greece where mostly introduced by abuse of the Greeks themselves. That is the small detail that mostly is left out.

"The UK has nothing to do with reforms concerning the EURO. That's up to France and Germany and the EU Central Bank."

The OP is talking about the measures the US has taking regarding the banks. We are taking about the reforms of the banks nothing regarding the currency. The thing the UK wanted an exemption for, the reason why a lot of measures couldn't be taken... .

"Those payments the UK makes is going too."

Yeah because that access to the single EU market will come for free... .

"Once this happens, I think you'll start to see other exit musings in other countries and it'll be the beginning of the end!"

What is that with that British obsession that some have with destroying Europe and bring instability to the continent?

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#145

Post by riprowan »

blahi wrote: post #64
Dylan16807 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can just print more money in proportion to population growth. While keeping a stable minimum reserve percent.

The rich people will be less rich in that situation. They are in a similar situation now with the current inflation, but growth of money has to be tied to economic growth or otherwise the rich will feel screwed. I'm not saying it's good, but you cannot screw the rich. The current situation is a compromise and a very sensible at that I might add, despite all the noise from tin-foil hatters. There are also other, pract…

History shows that you can screw the rich.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/10/Hinricht...

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#146

Post by matwood »

kbart wrote: post #103
rubber_duck wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The EU needs a face, parties with cross-border support, democracy, mandate... You know what's funny - US is constantly railing about inequality - meanwhile median income between poorest and richest EU members is close to 10x - in the US it's ~2-3 between states. It's no longer "the 1% are exploiting us" narrative and "democracy will save us" - these are similarly sized countries where people are 10x richer in one co…

"meanwhile median income between poorest and richest EU members is close to 10x - in the US it's ~2-3 between states" That's comparing apples to oranges. Country != state.

For the EU to work, the countries need to function more as states. Maybe this is just the hard road for the EU to get to something resembling the states, or it will fall apart as a failed experiment.

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#147

Post by ultramancool »

shoo wrote: post #44
basicplus2 wrote: post #26

EU now requires all member nations to enforce bail-in so ordinary depositors carry same risk as creditors of banks. America - Gone EU - Gone Canada - Gone New Zealand - Gone Australia - nearly gone - Turnbull was head of Goldman Sachs in Australia. All thanks to Goldman Sachs etc http://cecaust.com.au/releases/2014_03_20_Treasury_Bail_In.h... http://cecaust.com.au/releases/2015_11_27_G20_Accepts_Bailin... http://ceca…

Be aware: the above links point to press releases from the Citizen's Electoral Council - this is the most batshit insane political party I am aware of in Australia. You don't get to print and distribute pamphlets talking about lizard people running the world and then get to be taken seriously.

Where do I get the lizard people pamphlets?

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#148

Post by paulryanrogers »

mtanski wrote: post #116
pjmlp wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a foreign living in Germany I do appreciate the mentality that things "should be done the correct way", but many here don't understand you cannot just change a country's culture by forcing them to strictly follow EU rules. As it has already been proven by the lumping economies in the southern Europe, people will suffer and everyone will just make use of black market for jobs and goods to survive at any cost or jus…

> As a foreign living in Germany I do appreciate the mentality that things "should be done the correct way", but many here don't understand you cannot just change a country's culture by forcing them to strictly follow EU rules. You mean like Germany's biggest car maker solved the disel exhaust correctly? I don't your generalization stands up. What I can agree with is that the Germans are sticklers for sticklers sense…

> And I could argue that breaking more rules and being more aggressive during the financial melt down has left us much better of in the US.

Not sure the aggression and rule breaking are what has helped in the US. Considering the US debt and wasted bailout money I'm not so sure the US really is better off.

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#149

Post by gortok »

guelo wrote: post #24

It’s easy for Merkel to insist that Italy has to strictly follow EU rules since she doesn’t have to win an Italian election. The Euro just seems like a complete failure. Giant economies are limping along with 20% unemployment, unable to recover 8 years after the recession. In contrast the US has managed an OK recovery, now closing in on full employment. The problem is that each EU national leader is accountable only…

The US is closing in on "Full Employment", if by Full Employment, you mean:

January 2008 Labor Participation Rate: 66.2% July 2016 Labor Participation Rate: 62.7%

62.7% participation means 94 Million Americans are not working. (Source: http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/susan-jones/labor-force-...)

Full Employment only calculates people who are actively looking for work; anyone else is not part of that calculation.

To make an easier example, if 20 people are in a room, and 9 say "I'm employed", 1 says "I'm looking for work", and the other 10 say "I've been out of work for so long I'm not even looking), then that means:

90% employment (10% unemployment rate); but the labor force participation rate is only 50%.

Add another 5 people people to the mix (people that recently turned 18), and suddenly you have full employment, even if you have 10 of those 25 not looking for work or unable to work.

So to say "The US has an OK recovery and is closing in on Full employment" is an empty saying because you can have statistical full employment and have half of the population not holding a job.

Re: Italy’s teetering banks will be Europe’s next crisis

#150

Post by timwaagh »

if italy gets into trouble the EU will just force its members to give up more sovereignity so it can deal with the issue. they will go along because only the EU would be strong enough. which is very bad for the populist nationalist exiteers who have been causing so much trouble lately.
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