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Dark side of a Valley software engineer

businessinsider.com

11–20 of 89 posts

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#11

>>If your manager is not a software engineer himself you will have even more stress. Someone should do something about this. Certain other professions, such as the law, protect workers from incompetent management, in many jurisdictions. It might also attract more people to the profession if you knew your boss had done something similar.

On the other hand, not all managers with a tech background have good people skills to manage engineers.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#12
post #5

While a lot of the stories are pretty much "this insane thing is considered normal around here", there's some that I feel are due to management and should be changed - long hours or not. > harsh deadlines, huge backlog of tasks, fear to fail This happens everywhere. Deadlines exist because customers exist. All backlogs grow until they're silly. Companies may have a fear to fail. But if you have multiple engineers and…

Could it be it's just how it works in USA? I'm a software engineer in London and in the last 2 years I haven't done a single minute of overtime.

I'm pretty sure it's just USA. I make a good salary in the North East of UK and I was told multiple times by people from US that I'm crazy to work for that kind of money(If you moved to US, you would easily make 3-4x as much!). And sure, maybe it's true. But I enjoy working 37.5h/week, having 25 paid holiday days a year, unlimited paid sick leave and having a job that I actually like doing - plus I don't really have to think about it once I get home. Healtcare costs me about $100/month in NI contribution, education for my children will be free or almost free - Moving to US for some hypothetical higher salary just does not seem worth it to me at all.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could it be it's just how it works in USA? I'm a software engineer in London and in the last 2 years I haven't done a single minute of overtime.

I'm pretty sure it's just USA. I make a good salary in the North East of UK and I was told multiple times by people from US that I'm crazy to work for that kind of money(If you moved to US, you would easily make 3-4x as much!). And sure, maybe it's true. But I enjoy working 37.5h/week, having 25 paid holiday days a year, unlimited paid sick leave and having a job that I actually like doing - plus I don't really have…

Indeed. Your salary is relative. If you're earning 3-4x more but have to pay 3-4x more on all your expenses, are you really richer? Factor in long hours in general, unpaid overtime, crunch times, a poor work/life ratio in general, etc. It seems like the scales are balanced all wrong.

That's my perception as another tech worker living in the UK. I'd love to hear an argument as to why that isn't the case.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#14
post #5

While a lot of the stories are pretty much "this insane thing is considered normal around here", there's some that I feel are due to management and should be changed - long hours or not. > harsh deadlines, huge backlog of tasks, fear to fail This happens everywhere. Deadlines exist because customers exist. All backlogs grow until they're silly. Companies may have a fear to fail. But if you have multiple engineers and…

Could it be it's just how it works in USA? I'm a software engineer in London and in the last 2 years I haven't done a single minute of overtime.

Hehe, perhaps not only theory. I did loads of overtime in London, got a 50% pay rise and allowed to build and manage a team, then sent to the USA with UK holidays but US taxes (lower), free housing and further payrise.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#15
Then: Get up at 6am, go to work at grocery store. Get paid $7 an hour. Get out at 1pm, go to school. Go back to grocery store at 7 work till 12. Wake up do it again. Weekends nope. Holidays nope.

Now: Wake up at 8 get to work at like 8:45 work till 6 or 7. Sit in air conditioning all day at a computer. Free lunch. Go home, don't worry about anything. No tests to study for, no worrying about paying rent. Holidays off. Weekends off.

Yea development sucks sometimes but it's almost like doing nothing compared to what I was used to. Sometimes when I get frustrated I just have a flashback of my old life.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#16
post #3
post #2

So basically the place that everybody knows that is _the_ place where you have to work 170h/week gets now negative feedback for working that much? Oh well...

It reminds me of the pre-crash stories about corporate lawyers and then investment banking working mad work weeks. The difference at least in the case of SV that more people seem to enjoy their work.

The real difference is that a lot of those corporate lawyers and investment bankers make 3-10x the salary of SV engineer (multiple $ million per year).

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#18

>>If your manager is not a software engineer himself you will have even more stress. Someone should do something about this. Certain other professions, such as the law, protect workers from incompetent management, in many jurisdictions. It might also attract more people to the profession if you knew your boss had done something similar.

On the other hand, not all managers with a tech background have good people skills to manage engineers.

I don't think its so much people skills to manage engineers, more like people skills to talk to the managers above (i.e./ CEO). I think this, too, would be an interesting topic to delve deeper into.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could it be it's just how it works in USA? I'm a software engineer in London and in the last 2 years I haven't done a single minute of overtime.

Hehe, perhaps not only theory. I did loads of overtime in London, got a 50% pay rise and allowed to build and manage a team, then sent to the USA with UK holidays but US taxes (lower), free housing and further payrise.

I think generalizing in either direction is a waste of time. Surely where you live won't have that much effect on whether you've decided to work overtime or not.

Though I suppose it's more popular to start a business in some locations than in others.

Re: Dark side of a Valley software engineer

#20
This is why I always laugh when someone says "Start-Ups are hard! If you want to get rich easy, better get a job at a big company with 100k a year"

First, getting such a job is a ton of work and then doing it isn't easy either.

I mean, how much people even have the education to got into IT and then score a job at Google for example?

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