Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’ • Hacker News Board

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#61

Post by DominikR » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:34 PM UTC

whamlastxmas wrote: post #53

DominikR wrote: post #12

This is clearly a criminal and very evil act that will likely harm many people, not just emotionally but also physically. I wonder how anyone could be so deranged to do something like this. But it is also a cultural problem of these Muslim societies that they actually stone people to death for adultery. This is horrific. If I were to make a dating app then I would outright ban all of these countries because I don't w…

I find this comment offensive. You're implying the primary harm here is done by the hacker, not the people actually stoning others to death.

Sorry, but where exactly did I blame the victim? And where did I weight the guilt of the hacker vs the guilt of these societies that engage in such horrific acts?

Is there even a point in doing this? I despise both and that's what I said.

Besides, people would get hurt after such a leak even in the West. In most cases emotionally, but still there's a lot of people out there that could snap if they find out their wife has been cheating on them. It still happens.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#62

Post by rm_-rf_slash » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:38 PM UTC

nickpsecurity wrote: post #34

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #27

Given the other comments here and the longtime and blatant surveillance of Muslims by the FBI and NYPD, to name a few alphabet agencies, one would imagine that there is ample market opportunity in providing secure services and communications for Muslim clients. Might even have Islamic-appropriate functionality, such as allowing families to discuss potential marriages but forbidding the presumptive couple from communi…

"there is ample market opportunity in providing secure services and communications for Muslim clients." You mean aiding and abeitting terrorists? That's the nonsense they'll mention when they target that company or its founders. "They" means about any country in the Wassenar Agreement, part of many Eyes coalition, prone to mass surveillance, or concerned about terrorism. That's unfortunately about every democracy or…

If a terrorist organization wants secure communications, they will find a way to get them, whether by an app with encryption by default like Telegram or something they make in-house. You can't stop or prevent that unless you intend to do so for everybody on Earth.

It has nothing to do with being Muslim.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#63

Post by 01Michael10 » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:39 PM UTC

basseq wrote: post #45

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak. Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores". Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "thes…

Who has a value system where it's OK to lie and cheat on a person you entered into vows with? Regardless, it's not relevant what yours or my values are anyway on this. It's the person who is being cheated on that matters who obliviously doesn't have the same value system as the cheater so the behavior can only be seen as 'bad".

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#64

Post by dsfyu404ed » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:42 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #36

fahadkhan wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"what is a 'moderate muslim'." WOW! How do cope with such a high level of paranoia?

I'd say it's less paranoia and more "all we get from the media is anti-Muslim propaganda and reports of horrible things extremist Muslims do, it'd be nice to have something to point to that's not about that." Honestly I'd rather the mainstream media just starts doing consistent positive coverage on individuals in the Muslim community to counteract the negative news, but I'll take what I can get. I've had discussions…

I've had discussions with several wealthy upper class Americans (who should know better) that are totally brainwashed into believing being poor white trash, pro gun, pro gay marriage or pro abortion is synonymous with being pure evil.

The ability to fail to understand the difference between a group and it's most visible members is one that is common across ethnic and economic subsets of the population.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#65

Post by mikeash » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:42 PM UTC

basseq wrote: post #45

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak. Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores". Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "thes…

A major difference is that most AM users were in committed relationships and were attempting to cheat on their SO without their consent or knowledge, and the entire idea of the site was based around this. (I say "attempting to" because one of the more amusing tidbits from that leak was the fact that the site was pretty much useless.) They're hurting other people, not just themselves, not only emotionally but potentially physically due to the risk of STDs and such.

There's no such thing here. I'm sure there are some cheaters using this site, but I doubt it's the majority, and it doesn't appear to be the whole point of the site. Most people there were harming nobody.

I see a big difference between adultery, which is a broad category including many victimless behaviors, and cheating, which is a much narrow category where someone is necessarily being hurt. Attitudes toward adultery are very cultural, but I have no problem lumping cheating in with emotional abuse and physical harms as something which is objectively bad.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#66

Post by FilterSweep » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:43 PM UTC

basseq wrote: post #45

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak. Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores". Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "thes…

Do note there were multiple threads made on the same topic, and even within the individual ones, the responses vary over time (perhaps some of us didn't have our morning coffee yet).

I remember reading a lot over the people impacted adversely from the hack - who were not just failed adulterous men.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#67

Post by gbin » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:43 PM UTC

FreedomToCreate wrote: post #24

bmmayer1 wrote: post #8

This is a serious security threat for many Muslims abroad, given that premarital sex is severely punishable in several Islamic countries (including Pakistan mentioned in the leak), and even within countries where it isn't punishable by law, those who get caught frequently risk honor attacks from their families as has happened in the US, UK, India and elsewhere. Obviously dating != sex but there's probably enough 'smo…

Its a sad reality of the culture prevalent amongst poor and rich muslims. Hopefully no one becomes a target of any blasphemy laws. With that said, as someone who grew up as a direct witness to honor cultures and strong religious roots, labelling people who carry out violence as sadist is deluding yourself to reality. This isn't sadism, this isn't even fundamentalism. This is basis of a culture in which honor and reli…

There is nothing cut and dry: is the person in the crowd stoning a woman to a slow and painful death virtuous behind the cultural curtain ? Or part of a religious exploitation? Or part of a political exploitation ?

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#68

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:47 PM UTC

riyadparvez wrote: post #35

Does the hacker have any religious motivation? As an ex-Muslim, I cannot comprehend how someone in his/her right mind can do something like this. The people whose identities are revealed will be socially rejected in the best case; in the worst case, physical abuse, honor killings, and whatnot. These hackers should be prosecuted for intentionally risking other peoples lives.

[deleted]

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#69

Post by FreedomToCreate » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:51 PM UTC

basseq wrote: post #45

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak. Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores". Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "thes…

One big difference is that people outed by Ashley Madison were not at risk to the degree that muslim daters are at being harmed violently.

And even though the definition of adultery may vary between cultures, ignoring the difference between a website where you purposely go in blatant disregard of a personal and somewhat legal trust you established with someone versus a website where you go in an attempt to build a new relationship with the goal of finding a partner, are totally different things. This isn't "impressing" values. There is a clear difference in the acts.

To drive that point home, there is a clear difference between a 8 year old stealing something versus a 40 years old man. The 40 year old man knows the difference and the consequences while the 8 year old does not. When making a decision on punishment, it shouldn't matter what cultural values you have, there is a clear difference between the two that cannot be ignored. And that is the same things here. Dating versus adultery are more different than just different values.

So I wouldn't label this as hypocrisy as you are attempting to.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#70

Post by centizen » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:53 PM UTC

basseq wrote: post #45

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak. Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores". Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "thes…

I think it's an important point to bring up, but I don't feel like the same people who were passing judgement on the AM leak are the ones raising concerns here.

But if I had to explain the difference, I think it's the differences in potential backlash on the affected users. Majority of Ashely Madison users were not in countries that would severely persecute them for their activities.