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NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

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Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#91
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using the Treaty of Versailles as an example makes no sense. Are you suggesting war?

Why doesn't it make sense? Admittedly, it is a rather blatant example of what the parent comment asked for, but because it is so blatant it is also pretty uncontroversial that what happened was precisely foreign citizens having a say in the military program of another nation. Ok, here is another example for you, not involving open warfare: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_on_the_Non-Proliferatio...

> Why doesn't it make sense?

Because it is a treaty that was implemented after a World War? Circumstances of implementation matter. It is also a great example of a treaty that backfired and led to another war due to its sanctions end results. I'll also say you're stretching the analogy of a treaty as a way for a foreign citizen to have a say in another nations affairs. Technically correct but I don't think that really gets at "foreign citizen not of the ruling class of another country influencing another countries military programs (note no espionage examples)" Unless you're looking at a vassal state I don't see it happening.

The non proliferation treaty is similarly a poor example as it was multiple nations deciding in their interests to stay on top with nuclear weapons and not allow more. What would better convince people would be another country impacting another countries military program negatively, not for mutual gain.

The grandparent comment was referring to influencing the NSA surveillance of foreign countries. Guess what, as an American I have no say over the spy agencies of France, or any multitude of agencies either. The NSA just has been doing a better job at it for numerous historical reasons. I'm not condoning it but so far you've not really provided a convincing argument that foreign citizens can influence other countries espionage agencies.

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you think using any of that protects you from the Chinese, KGB, etc.? Did you forget to block localStorage, too?

The KGB ceased to exist in 1991 with the break-up of the Soviet Union, a full three years before HTTPS was invented. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KGB https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTPS

Has nothing to do with my point. Quit pretending the Russians don't have a spy agency.

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people they kill are those who have killed others. Quit pretending they are innocents just minding their own business.

Or sometimes wedding parties, such as one where the US government murdered 47 innocent people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deh_Bala_wedding_party_airstri...

You mean like the 3000 in the World Trade Center?

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was happy to see the disgust people had for the CIA black sites operated in other countries when that came to light during the Bush presidency. Not because of the torture, but because people here expected alleged terrorists to have the same rights as detained American citizens. I feel this is important to note, because we have a large population of young voters who I feel have concern for everyone - not just the US…

unfortunately you're part of a minority. The mere fact that the election will happen between Clinton and Trump makes me think that mass surveillance and lack of respect for other countries are going to continue and probably worsen. Clinton: http://time.com/4150694/hillary-clinton-calls-for-more-surve... Trump (not that it's really necessary): http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/26167...

[deleted]

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#95
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the same about the KGB and China's spy agencies. How come I have no say in how they operate?

KGB doesn't exist for more than 25 years. Checking your facts would be a first step, i guess.

Fine, substitute FSB if you must..now back to the point of the comment..

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was happy to see the disgust people had for the CIA black sites operated in other countries when that came to light during the Bush presidency. Not because of the torture, but because people here expected alleged terrorists to have the same rights as detained American citizens. I feel this is important to note, because we have a large population of young voters who I feel have concern for everyone - not just the US…

unfortunately you're part of a minority. The mere fact that the election will happen between Clinton and Trump makes me think that mass surveillance and lack of respect for other countries are going to continue and probably worsen. Clinton: http://time.com/4150694/hillary-clinton-calls-for-more-surve... Trump (not that it's really necessary): http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/26167...

> “We have to stop jihadists from radicalizing new recruits in person and through social media chat rooms, and what’s called the dark web,” Clinton said.

> Clinton said she would ask technology companies in Silicon Valley to expand their oversight of posts that could be used to radicalize recruits. Tech companies, she said, should enforce strong service agreements and track questionable content.

She scares me as much as Trump.

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#97
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that outrage over the Patriot act abuses? Obama 2008 platform promised to restore the Constitution: > We reject the use of national security letters to spy on citizens who are not suspected of a crime. We reject the tracking of citizens who do nothing more than protest a misguided war. We reject torture. We reject sweeping claims of "inherent" presidential power. We will revisit the Patriot Act and overturn…

That's part of the reason I spend every political conversation discussing the merits of a multiparty (not biparty) system. Pretty sure I've convinced at least a handful of people to vote Gary Johnson as a protest vote. Though personally I'm all about that #Snowden2016

I don't think a responsible person can possibly vote for a major party candidate. Doing so just results in the same powerful interests remaining entrenched.

There's always the "oh no what if so and so gets elected" but it always turns out that any major party candidate does pretty much the same stuff once elected. Obama continued and extended the Bush Doctrine on foreign affairs, for example.

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Educate yourself: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/civilian-deaths-drone-st...

And when the twin towers fell in NYC, were there any innocents involved?

I remember clearly when we finally drone-bombed the 9/11 attackers to dust, what a glorious day that was. wait, what?

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#99
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that outrage over the Patriot act abuses? Obama 2008 platform promised to restore the Constitution: > We reject the use of national security letters to spy on citizens who are not suspected of a crime. We reject the tracking of citizens who do nothing more than protest a misguided war. We reject torture. We reject sweeping claims of "inherent" presidential power. We will revisit the Patriot Act and overturn…

That's part of the reason I spend every political conversation discussing the merits of a multiparty (not biparty) system. Pretty sure I've convinced at least a handful of people to vote Gary Johnson as a protest vote. Though personally I'm all about that #Snowden2016

More than two parties is not that great either. At least here in the USA you need to win a majority of the electoral college to win the presidency or else congress will elect one for you.

Re: NSA tracking cellphone locations worldwide, Snowden documents show (2013)

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The KGB ceased to exist in 1991 with the break-up of the Soviet Union, a full three years before HTTPS was invented. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KGB https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTPS

Has nothing to do with my point. Quit pretending the Russians don't have a spy agency.

We are supposed to fear the Chinese? Russians? The citizens of those nations should perhaps fear those governments, but the typical American has nothing whatsoever to fear from them.
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