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Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

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Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#51

Post by twoodfin »

Stratoscope wrote: post #29
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #6

Growing up, I remember Marina Foods in Cupertino being much fresher than the other grocers. > Chinatown’s green grocers, in contrast, buy their stock from a handful of small wholesalers operating from tiny warehouses right in the neighborhood Chipotle tried hyper-localised procurement and processing. That backfired, since heterogeneity in sourcing and processing means heterogeneity in quality control. How do these ma…

I had the good fortune to grow up when Have Gun Will Travel was first broadcast. One of my favorite episodes was Gun Shy, where Paladin travels to Montana and visits Ma Warren's boarding house. Ma's house was famous for its food. Paladin lived in San Francisco and enjoyed the city's finest, and he was surprised and delighted with what Ma Warren prepared in this remote area. She was obviously a talented cook, but Pala…

I'm pretty sure that health incidents due to food-borne pathogens have declined dramatically in the past 150 years. Eating at Chipotle is probably an order of magnitude safer on average than eating at the real "Ma Warren's" of 1875.

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#52

Post by dogma1138 »

mikeryan wrote: post #33
jimmywanger wrote: post #17

I think that one factor is that in the Chinese culture, you don't expect everything to be good and available during all seasons. At a Whole Foods, you can reasonably be assured of asparagus in the winter time. In Chinatown, things are only available when they're in season, like a farmers' market. Also, if you've ever ordered at a Chinese restaurant with a Chinese family, you'll see this phenomenon. Instead of orderin…

There's a lot of western restaurants (Admittedly usually on the higher end) who change their menus seasonally, if not daily to reflect whats available. Its part of what the whole farm-to-table phenomenon is about.

It's not about farm to table, it's about economics and about what people prefer to eat especially in places where there is a big difference between winter and summer. Gazpacho isn't a dish you really want to have when the temperatures drop below 0, but on a hot summer day is perfection.

Pretty much most restaurants regardless of being high end or not, have fish of the day, soup of the day, dish of the day etc. that's just a normal reaction to the supply of the market during that day as it's often considerably cheaper to secure the daily catch or w/e your veggie guy has that morning than securing seasonal items daily.

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#53

Post by jimmywanger »

mikeryan wrote: post #33
jimmywanger wrote: post #17

I think that one factor is that in the Chinese culture, you don't expect everything to be good and available during all seasons. At a Whole Foods, you can reasonably be assured of asparagus in the winter time. In Chinatown, things are only available when they're in season, like a farmers' market. Also, if you've ever ordered at a Chinese restaurant with a Chinese family, you'll see this phenomenon. Instead of orderin…

There's a lot of western restaurants (Admittedly usually on the higher end) who change their menus seasonally, if not daily to reflect whats available. Its part of what the whole farm-to-table phenomenon is about.

One thing is a lot of asian recipes tend to be more modular.

Also, the middle/lower range asian restaurants can't afford to print menus each day.

So for instance, if the shrimp don't look good that day, they'll gladly throw in the littleneck clams that just came in. Same with green leafy vegetables, where they're pretty much interchangeable.

"We have ong choy instead of a choy. Deal with it."

Whereas in a lot of western cuisines, if you need endive in a dish, it has to be endive. Especially in higher end restaurants. They care so much about the flavor that substitutions are not possible.

Maybe this green is slightly more bitter than this other green, and it throws off the whole flavor of the dish. Whereas, in a lower/middle end asian restaurant, nobody really cares.

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#54

Post by dnautics »

Stratoscope wrote: post #29
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #6

Growing up, I remember Marina Foods in Cupertino being much fresher than the other grocers. > Chinatown’s green grocers, in contrast, buy their stock from a handful of small wholesalers operating from tiny warehouses right in the neighborhood Chipotle tried hyper-localised procurement and processing. That backfired, since heterogeneity in sourcing and processing means heterogeneity in quality control. How do these ma…

I had the good fortune to grow up when Have Gun Will Travel was first broadcast. One of my favorite episodes was Gun Shy, where Paladin travels to Montana and visits Ma Warren's boarding house. Ma's house was famous for its food. Paladin lived in San Francisco and enjoyed the city's finest, and he was surprised and delighted with what Ma Warren prepared in this remote area. She was obviously a talented cook, but Pala…

There's also this effect that you hear when there's a chipotle incident anywhere in the country, but if there's a local grocery incident, it will either be local, or, not at all (because the victim count will be so low).

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#56

Post by jimmywanger »

jzwinck wrote: post #45
jimmywanger wrote: post #17

I think that one factor is that in the Chinese culture, you don't expect everything to be good and available during all seasons. At a Whole Foods, you can reasonably be assured of asparagus in the winter time. In Chinatown, things are only available when they're in season, like a farmers' market. Also, if you've ever ordered at a Chinese restaurant with a Chinese family, you'll see this phenomenon. Instead of orderin…

Is this an American Chinese thing? I live in Asia and when I ask what's good they usually say something generic like "The rice dishes are good."

It helps if you speak the language. I'm not saying you don't speak the language, just for those following along at home.

You have to have some rough idea of what you want. If you want stir fried vegetables, you'll say something like "I want stir fried vegetables. What's good today?" Or "I want a seafood noodle soup. How do the mussels look? Any suggestions?"

Time location is important. Instead of just saying "What's good?" ask "I like rice plates. Anything good come in today?"

Finally, it's not always like this. I know I've squashed down at some street vendors and ordered a bowl of noodles without this conversation. This doesn't happen at every meal.

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#57

Post by driverdan »

jimmywanger wrote: post #17

I think that one factor is that in the Chinese culture, you don't expect everything to be good and available during all seasons. At a Whole Foods, you can reasonably be assured of asparagus in the winter time. In Chinatown, things are only available when they're in season, like a farmers' market. Also, if you've ever ordered at a Chinese restaurant with a Chinese family, you'll see this phenomenon. Instead of orderin…

> At a Whole Foods...

I'm curious why did you compare to Whole Foods? They are far more expensive than a regular grocery store and their food is not better.

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#58

Post by sidek »

jimmywanger wrote: post #56
jzwinck wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this an American Chinese thing? I live in Asia and when I ask what's good they usually say something generic like "The rice dishes are good."

It helps if you speak the language. I'm not saying you don't speak the language, just for those following along at home. You have to have some rough idea of what you want. If you want stir fried vegetables, you'll say something like "I want stir fried vegetables. What's good today?" Or "I want a seafood noodle soup. How do the mussels look? Any suggestions?" Time location is important. Instead of just saying "What's…

Really? Lived in HK for a long time, had lots of friends who grew up there/were very local.. never saw this happen. Is it regional?

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#59

Post by t3ra »

hackuser wrote: post #40

I don't understand how this works out: > Because the wholesalers are in Chinatown, they can deliver fresh produce several times a day, eliminating the need for retailers to maintain storage space or refrigeration Somebody has to store the inventory someplace, incurring those storage costs, whether it's the retailer, wholesaler, or someone further upstream. And regardless of who stores it, I'd expect those costs to ha…

Doing daily harvesting isn't that unlikely also not everything is harvested at same hour of the day. And storing inventory is open for just few hours doesn't spoil the veggies.

Re: Why Fruits and Veggies Are So Cheap in Chinatown

#60

Post by vinceguidry »

grok2 wrote: post #47
vinceguidry wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Demand. Chinatown can do it because it's ethnic residents don't just want a great selection of produce, they demand it. They want it bad enough to fuel an entire alternative supply chain. If the people buying Chinatown's produce were replaced by less-discerning customers, the produce markets would disappear overnight and the farmers would have to unload their current crops at cut-rate prices. Normal customers don't w…

This still doesn't explain why it is cheap -- it's cheap likely because there are not too many steps between the consumer and the producer? And not too much money spent on infrastructure...

I bet the produce wasn't so cheap at first. Economies of scale had to get wrung out over decades. This is where the "China" in Chinatown becomes important, the Chinese really value the sort of long-term thinking that makes this kind of endeavor profitable.
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