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The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

troyhunt.com

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Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#181

Is there a way to disable just pieces of JS, so I can turn off "onpaste"? note: sorry, accidentally deleted earlier version of this comment.

I just added it to my list of stuff that pushing this bookmarklet button fixes:

javascript:void(document.onmousedown=null);void(document.onclick=null);void(document.oncontextmenu=null);void(document.onpaste=null)

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HSBC doesn't do that any more for me -- they've moved to a Google Authenticator-like 2FA approach[1], but Lloyds[2] does - they have one username and password, and a "memorable phrase" which they clearly store as plaintext because ask for the xth, yth and zth character as a secondary security measure. Lloyds tech folk reading this -- please consider fixing this. [1] http://i.imgur.com/QCGPDWz.png [2] http://i.imgur.c…

I do not agree that they store a password in plain text. You cannot say for sure. What if they hash each character and store each with its position in the db?

That wouldnbe still pain text actually, because it's easy to have a table for hash -> char. Chararcters being limited by their numbers.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You realize that this is trivial to brute force, though.

I never said it was a good way of storing passwords. It reduces entropy. I'm just saying there is way to both have hashed password storage as well as "asking for 3 random letters of you password at login".

You replied to a comment saying "That implies that they store plaintext or something reversible." You posted about hashing in a way that implies that comment is wrong. But that comment is completely correct. Taking three characters and hashing it is easily reversible. And then the attacker gets to log in.

The question is not whether on a technical level something got hashed. The question is whether a hash protects the password against brute forcing. And the answer is no.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#184
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

me: Hi Mate, what is your email password? email recipient: Pasword123 me: thanks. JOB DONE :-)

Well, I was hoping for something at least a little bit more sophisticated.

Nah... it's brute force all the way down. Scammers aren't brilliant men in dashing suits who swindle bankers, they're assholes who prey on the weakest. The second you do something that doesn't mark you as weak in some way, they don't want you anyway. It's the human equivalent of scanning large IP blocks for basic security holes.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#185
post #180

Here in Norway, almost all financial and government institutions allow a form of authentication called BankID ( https://www.bankid.no/en/company/ ). I use the mobile variant and it works for all government related stuff like taxes, health, relocation notices and also with all banks both when logging in and paying bills, signing contracts etc. It is a legally binding identification akin to signing a paper. The procedu…

This is what we use here in Sweden as well. The reason it works is that all inhabitants are given a personal identification number upon birth, that consists of our birthday + 4 digits which are loosely based on where we are born and if we are male/female. This number is unique for every person and is used to register to the BankID service (among other things) and ensures that it is connected to a single individual.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#186
post #114
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HSBC has this really odd system where they only ask for the (e.g.) 1st, 6th, and 7th characters of your password. That implies that they store plaintext or something reversible...

Yes. This is to protect against attackers obtaining your full plaintext password on your end, for example by phishing or installing keyloggers. In practice this is a much bigger security threat in the online banking world than someone doing the same by compromising the bank's systems - even if that were to happen they can easily re-verify your identity and issue you with a new password, and you really shouldn't be us…

It's a ridiculous practice and storing the passwords in plaintext is deplorable. Banks have your phone number, (which can't simply be changed online) and that is the best additional line of security.

The scrambled on-screen keyboard / n-th character request only poorly "protects" against cases where the attacker has full root access to the customer's machine (how would it protect against phishing?), and in those cases the attacker is likely already capable of making all kinds of payments, even without access to the online banking account. If security is done properly, an attacker can't make direct use of a banking account anyways: creating a new transfer recipient should require phone confirmation by default.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#187
post #180

Here in Norway, almost all financial and government institutions allow a form of authentication called BankID ( https://www.bankid.no/en/company/ ). I use the mobile variant and it works for all government related stuff like taxes, health, relocation notices and also with all banks both when logging in and paying bills, signing contracts etc. It is a legally binding identification akin to signing a paper. The procedu…

We have the same thing in Sweden. The mobile version also supports biometric authentication (TouchID on iOS devices) for less risky operations like logging in and transferring between pre-approved accounts. Very convenient and quite secure.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You realize that this is trivial to brute force, though.

No. You limit to 3 attempts per user before you go to the bank to show ID. Why do hacker news people think they are better at security than multi billion dollar banks?

You're conflating completely different kinds of security.

Banks are good at not losing money.

But website security is an afterthought for them.

It's easy to make a website that has better security practices than a typical bank website.

It's not about having better skills or resources, it's about having the motivation to do it in the first place.

A bank could set up spectacular security, but that doesn't mean they usually do so.

Re: The “Cobra Effect” that is disabling paste on password fields

#190
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like I'm missing a GUI-limb when I'm on Windows and don't have the highlight buffer/middle-click paste...

TXMouse[0]--I've been using it for years. It's just what you want. 0 - http://fy.chalmers.se/~appro/nt/TXMouse/

Sadly did not work very well for me with Windows 7. In some situations it works like in X11, in some nothing happens (no copy/paste). Breaks opening links with middle click... Is there some alternative or fix that would make it function more like in X11 ?
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