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UK votes to leave EU

bbc.co.uk

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Re: UK votes to leave EU

#561

Post by chvid »

_ph_ wrote: post #468

A very sad day for everyone in Europe. The EU is not only about trade regulations, but about a continent who had a not very peaceful history finally growing together. The freedom of movement for European citizens was not only "convenient" but in fact an important civil right. When you live or have a business in one state of the US, you are bound to local regulations of course, but being part of the US granted you a l…

* EU has got to deliver *

It needs to show that it can provide solutions for the euro financial crisis and the refugee crisis. Solutions that are sound, long term and have popular backing.

It has shown that it cannot.

And thus we europeans are better of with a smaller, simpler european cooperation of independent nation states.

At least this should be the very real threat the EU politicians should operate under.

We need a better EU.

Re: UK votes to leave EU

#562

Post by tmptmp »

I wish to point out an important but not-directly-economical angle to Brexit that has seemed to play an important role.

I wish the liberals take a notice of the problem of immigration, mainly the immigration of from Islamic countries. I am a liberal at the core. But what I have found that when it comes to Islam, many mainstream liberals and liberal politicians follow a double standard. The legitimate criticism of Islam, Quran and its prophet are shunned by many mainstream liberals by labeling it as racist attacks, Islamophobia, far-right and what not. I call such people phoney liberals.

The phoney liberals take a stance that the Britons/Europeans should bend over backwards to accommodate Muslims along with their medieval, backward Islamic way of life in order for the integration. They never tell Muslims in clear words that "Look, we have a policy of separation of church and state, in your case it means separation of mosque and state. You should accept, if you want to live here, that we value freedom of speech and that includes freedom to offend you too by criticizing Islam or by making fun of your religion, your prophet, your scriptures and your religious practices." But what did the phoney liberals do after Charlie Hebdo episode? They criticized the tabloid for being offending to Muslims.

A liberal thinker Bill Maher has put this in a very good manner [1],[2],[3],[4]

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntv3a80RGiw

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PL8rZTuGfZo

[3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Zfgj2k0KM

[4] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipu0ifyC-Xc

Re: UK votes to leave EU

#564

Post by aryehof »

pavornyoh wrote: post #102

A bit of a naive question as I am fascinated by what is happening. I admit I don't completely understand so my question is if the UK is made up of England, Northern Ireland, Wales and Scotland why aren't they represented at the European cup currently being held/played in France as the United Kingdom? Why are they playing as separate countries yet voting together to leave the EU? I don't get it.

Because despite all the pointers to "definitions" to the contrary, the United Kingdom is but a single country, with a single passport, a single UN seat, one olympic team, one set of defense forces, and with a single central government only which can enter into formal agreements with foreign powers.

Any dissolution of power to "regions" like Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland is at the discretion of the central government, which can remove them at will.

The fact that it has separate sports teams is a weird throwback to history, now intended perhaps to largely confuse foreigners. (Perhaps a clever way to allow the UK to increase its odds of winning? :)

Re: UK votes to leave EU

#567

Post by cabalamat »

redthrowaway wrote: post #487
_ph_ wrote: post #468

A very sad day for everyone in Europe. The EU is not only about trade regulations, but about a continent who had a not very peaceful history finally growing together. The freedom of movement for European citizens was not only "convenient" but in fact an important civil right. When you live or have a business in one state of the US, you are bound to local regulations of course, but being part of the US granted you a l…

The US did not magic itself into existence as a united state. It began in common purpose with a shared, very strong, external enemy. It then assigned itself a shared dream of settling the content. And, crucially, it already had a shared cultural identity, shared language, and shared religion when it began. The EU does not have a common enemy to force it together. It does not have a shared language, or culture, or ide…

> The EU does not have a common enemy to force it together.

Yes it does, Russia.

Re: UK votes to leave EU

#568

Post by cabalamat »

> What culture do Germans, Greeks, Latvians, Bulgarians, Fins, and Spaniards share?

The one that used to be called the Roman Empire, then Christendom, and is now called Western Civilisation. It is also arguably the greatest achievement of the human species.

Re: UK votes to leave EU

#569

Post by [deleted] »

imtringued wrote: post #457
wildmusings wrote: post #143

Take the US federal government, take away 2/3 of Congress's powers, give all of those powers to the civil service, and then replace the President with a committee appointed by state governments on a staggered basis. That's the EU. Congratulations Britain, today you took back control of your own destiny.

I'm sorry for your loss.

[deleted]

Re: UK votes to leave EU

#570

Post by chombier »

davnn wrote: post #288

I truly do not understand our society. Europe is split, even if the countries aren't, the people are. Every political decision ends up being a race of the well-educated against the less-educated. The clash of classes happens not only in Europe, the Trump success is the same story. Maybe I'm just too young and uninformed to understand and that's how the world works ever since?

The well-educated people have been promising growth and prosperity to the less-educated for the last 30 years or so.

It did work out quite well for the well-educated, but not so well for the less-educated. So now the less-educated beg to differ.

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