Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat • Hacker News Board

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#311

Post by MustardTiger » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:03 AM UTC

Declanomous wrote: post #254

zem wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i have a vegan friend who swears by her brand of fake cheese; she's even made bruschetta with it and had it turn out okay. also i didn't know you got actual lactose-free ice cream; the lactose-intolerant people i've known usually ate coconut-based ice creams. i wonder if any of them had tried the lactose free stuff but found they were more used to the coconut.

Lactaid makes lactose-free versions of many dairy products that usually contain lactose, including ice cream. A special process isn't necessary for most cheeses since they naturally have very low levels of lactose due, since the lactose doesn't really get caught up in the coagulation. I've never had coconut ice cream, but I've had soy ice cream on several occasions and I thought it wasn't bad. (Shout-out to Chocolate…

>Lactaid makes lactose-free versions of many dairy products that usually contain lactose, including ice cream

Despite the label claiming that, it isn't actually the case. Rather than removing the sugar, which is quite difficult without affecting the milk, they simply add lactase.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#312

Post by MustardTiger » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:04 AM UTC

wcummings wrote: post #245

ergothus wrote: post #26

I've been a vegetarian for the last decade and change, and I simultaneously think that finding a cheaper, appealing alternative to meat is both a fantastic opportunity for the world and a really difficult thing. I used to love meat when I was a meat-eater, and I'm a fairly picky eater that dislikes many vegetable options. (Green peppers are nasty and food-destroying in my opinion, which immediately removes over half…

>And in america, at least, where meat-eating is tied to masculinity and bacon is worshipped, that's a tough stigma to shake. Being a picky eater is a childish trait, not sure how it became synonymous with "masculinity."

It didn't. Eating meat did. It has nothing to do with being picky.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#313

Post by MustardTiger » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:08 AM UTC

walrus01 wrote: post #124

Crazywater wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quorn? It's pretty close to chicken. But then again, chicken is also relatively easy to emulate since it doesn't have a lot of flavor or texture.

Grocery store chicken in North America has no flavor or texture because of the speed it's "grown" in factory farms. Almost to the point where a fried chicken breast is like a mass of dense meat-like wonderbread. I'm no organic foods/free range/whatever zealot, but if you eat a chicken raised on a small farm in Pakistan or Indonesia it probably took 3x as long to grow to full size, ate a much more varied diet and also…

>but if you eat a chicken raised on a small farm in Pakistan or Indonesia it probably took 3x as long to grow to full size, ate a much more varied diet and also has SIGNIFICANTLY more flavor in the meat.

They have small farms and dual purpose chicken breeds in the US too. You don't even need the small farm, you can raise them yourself quite easily and cheaply.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#314

Post by cname » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:17 AM UTC

pombrand wrote: post #168

bradbeattie wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the same camp as you. Vegetarian since 1989, vegan since 1999. I can certainly say that the quality of fake meats has drastically improved in the past 10 years (see https://gardein.com/ , http://fieldroast.com/ , and http://beyondmeat.com/ as examples), but the stigma surrounding them persists. Short anecdote: There's a donut shop in my town that sold vegan and regular donuts in adjacent but separate displays.…

Huge problem with the vegan meat replacements is that they're a lot more expensive than beef, around $7/lb vs ground beef at $3/lb. Like with coal vs solar, for imitation meat to win the market it needs to get less expensive than real meat (and taste as good).

You can't just compare to ground beef though. Plenty of meat and cheese products are the same price or more than equivalent meat alternatives.

[Aside: Actually, it's kind of interesting to consider that meat alternatives top out at a relatively low price point, whereas meat, fish, etc can get really expensive.]

Just like in the meat market, there are cheaper and more expensive meat alternatives. Compare tofu at ~$2/lb vs Field Roast at ~$6/lb, where Field Roast is more toward the gourmet end of the non-meat spectrum.

I would think that if you're not a meat eater, tofu is your ground beef equivalent. Or maybe beans, lentils, quinoa, etc, which are also pretty cheap.

Also, home made seitan is super cheap and much easier to produce than home made meat.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#315

Post by discardorama » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:18 AM UTC

ergothus wrote: post #26

I've been a vegetarian for the last decade and change, and I simultaneously think that finding a cheaper, appealing alternative to meat is both a fantastic opportunity for the world and a really difficult thing. I used to love meat when I was a meat-eater, and I'm a fairly picky eater that dislikes many vegetable options. (Green peppers are nasty and food-destroying in my opinion, which immediately removes over half…

> I've had chicken nuggets that meat eaters had no idea were fake,

Because chicken nuggets are mystery meats to start with. They're usually made from meat slurry, with various fillers added, and shaped into that shape. A chicken breast, for example, has 43g of protein per 140g of weight; a nugget, on the other hand, has 3.1g of protein per 20g of weight.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#316

Post by cname » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:29 AM UTC

Sacho wrote: post #272

maerF0x0 wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or the subsidies that hide the facts. Beef is very expensive in the sense of TCO, but not that expensive at the grocery store. See: http://michaelpollan.com/profiles/the-high-price-of-cheap-fo... for a good read on the matter. a snip: "The industrial food chain does produce food more cheaply, in terms of the price you pay at McDonald’s or the supermarket,” replies Pollan, “but the real cost of cheap food is not refle…

$20 billion comes up under $100 per person per year in the US. Even giving it a generous x4 multiplier to account for the people subsidizing the industry without being consumers, at $400 per year, given the $3 and $7 prices by parent, you would need to eat under 100 pounds of meat for meat replacements to be viable. The average American allegedly consumes close to 200 pounds of meat[0] per year, so it ends up still b…

You're making the incorrect assumption that vegetarians are replacing whatever meat they were eating with the more-expensive meat substitutes. As I noted in my comment above, there are plenty of meat substitutes and alternatives that are much cheaper than $7/lb.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#317

Post by Turing_Machine » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:30 AM UTC

fakemeatsubs wrote: post #238

Xixi wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those who are wondering if there are alternative to animal gelatin, Japanese have been using agar [1] (they call it kanten ) for centuries to prepare sweets. It's similar to gelatin, but made from algae, so it is absolutely vegetarian. As far as I know all Japanese traditional sweets that require something gelatinous are made with it, so they are safe to it if you are vegetarian/vegan. [1] https://en.wikipedia.or…

Wow, I didn't realise that agar the same products used in science experiments/testing was also the food thing (wiki lists uses as microbiology and culinary) . I recall the smell of the agar used in the lab to be very strong and quite off putting if thought of as a food. Has your experience of the aroma of culinary agar been positive?

The agar used in labs generally has a lot of other (potentially smelly) stuff put in it, depending on what kind of microorganisms you're trying to grow.

Pure agar is odorless and tasteless.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#318

Post by galangalalgol » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:30 AM UTC

ergothus wrote: post #26

I've been a vegetarian for the last decade and change, and I simultaneously think that finding a cheaper, appealing alternative to meat is both a fantastic opportunity for the world and a really difficult thing. I used to love meat when I was a meat-eater, and I'm a fairly picky eater that dislikes many vegetable options. (Green peppers are nasty and food-destroying in my opinion, which immediately removes over half…

My concern is health. Soy even fermented isn't that great. It is a trigger food for many as well. The amino profile is an issue too. Rice\pea is the closest I've found but lean poultry is the king of protein quality and until I see bodybuilders switching I'll stick with that. I know they also use whey which works for me but makes me put on fat. I have tried vegan and vegetarian, but after more than a month on each I never got out of the feeling fluish phase. Atkins did the same thing. So I just stick with vegetables, lean white meat, a few fruits, and a handful or two of whole grains and nuts a day. And some eggs, dietary cholesterol is not blood cholesterol.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#319

Post by Turing_Machine » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:34 AM UTC

VLM wrote: post #195

downandout wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Decent imitations of highly processed meat exist already I am a meat eater and I can tell you that, in my experience, this simply isn't the case. Your opinion is colored by the fact that you really, really, want it to be a decent imitation because you're a vegetarian. Every imitation meat product I have ever tasted has been immediately recognizable as such, and was almost inedible. Unfortunately, the idea of fake me…

With all due respect we can agree on your factual observations, yet while you're pessimistic about replacing a top quality perfectly grilled London Broil steak, I'm feeling optimistic about replacing a mcdonalds hamburger, which also is immediately recognizable as almost inedible. How about that stick of beef jerky I carry when I go out hiking ... replacing something that artificial with something plant based doesn't…

"a mcdonalds hamburger, which also is immediately recognizable as almost inedible."

People don't buy 6 million units per day when something is "almost inedible".

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#320

Post by not_today_james » Wed, Jun 22, 2016, 2:35 AM UTC

insaneirish wrote: post #304

> And because it's plant-based, this "meat" has no cholesterol. This statement is loaded with judgment. In response, I'd love if the author could provide some good data that shows a link between dietary cholesterol and blood serum cholesterol, let alone between dietary cholesterol and mortality.

Also see: https://chemistry.osu.edu/~gopalan.5/file/7B.PDF