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“PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

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Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#191

Post by distances »

eyko wrote: post #141
thirdsun wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a german that's not my experience at all. Credit cards aren't that common here and SEPA transfers are slow as hell and always a minor hassle, that I tend to avoid as long as I can. Without Paypal a lot of european customers wouldn't be able to buy from international vendors.

What about debit cards? I mean, you don't carry cash around all the time do you?

In Germany people do carry cash. Especially in Berlin, where there are plenty of smaller stores and restaurants that accept only cash.

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#192

Post by [deleted] »

WA wrote: post #131
benevol wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having read during the last few years about the endless horror stories businesses have endured with PayPal, I honestly don't understand why anyone would still use PayPal when there clearly are alternatives (be that US companies like Stripe or EU companies like Paymill).

Because they're still anecdotal and for most people, PayPal works just fine. I find the stories horrifying, but I ran about 40,000 transactions through PayPal in the last 5-6 years and never had any problems. I guess this is how it is for most people, at least, I can use PayPal as a buyer on most online businesses I deal with.

[deleted]

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#193

Post by joshmanders »

alyandon wrote: post #158
WA wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they're still anecdotal and for most people, PayPal works just fine. I find the stories horrifying, but I ran about 40,000 transactions through PayPal in the last 5-6 years and never had any problems. I guess this is how it is for most people, at least, I can use PayPal as a buyer on most online businesses I deal with.

Sure, using PayPal as a buyer is great as long as you never get into a dispute with a seller. It took about 4 months for me to get PayPal to refund my money when a seller on eBay ripped me off. PayPal support was so inept they claimed that I had not returned the merchandise despite giving them the DHL tracking number and shipping receipt multiple times and eventually they closed my case in favor of the merchant. I ha…

I used to accept PayPal as a payment method when I was doing freelancing, ran hundreds of thousands of dollars through my account over the many years of having it. One client refuted a payment SIX MONTHS later, and they granted it to him based on the fact that it was a digital service and there's no way to verify it was successfully transferred.

I immediately closed my bank account (PayPal wouldn't let me remove it while a refund was being made. Yes they were going to debit my bank account since I had no funds in my account, which I never kept).

Now they've put that amount in collections and honestly, as someone who cares about his credit, that one will stay the time until it's removed. I'm not paying them, or the thief.

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#194

Post by joergsauer »

benevol wrote: post #156

It's time to share & spread information about PayPal's competitors: What has your experience or market research yielded (stripe.com and paymill.de probably being the most obvious ones)?

Paymill seems to have a somewhat uncertain future at this point: http://ecommercenews.eu/german-payment-provider-paymill-file...

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#195

Post by ceejayoz »

Sir_Substance wrote: post #72
thwd wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed; with both of you. Maybe it won't be crypto-currencies, but Paypal Has To Go®. Let them screw up two or three more times. They're antiquated and operate like a typical barely-legal, gray-area, fee-riddled credit institution. I wonder why Douglas Crockford, a brilliant man, still works there (other than obviously well compensated time).

>Agreed; with both of you. Maybe it won't be crypto-currencies, but Paypal Has To Go®. Let them screw up two or three more times. They've already screwed up and screwed people over publicly dozens of times. Paypal does have to go, but I don't think paypal will die until someone offers an equivalent service.

> They've already screwed up and screwed people over publicly dozens of times.

If that's the standard, there likely isn't a single major corporation that'd meet it.

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#196

Post by celticninja »

tobltobs wrote: post #159
celticninja wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

look into bitcoin.

Sending money in an envelope would be easier and more accepted.

Not if you are in Germany, with bitcoin.de it is a very simple process.

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#197

Post by celticninja »

vidarh wrote: post #79
celticninja wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They only just got chip and pin cards, while everyone else is moving to contactless payments.

A lot of US banks have actually opted for chip and signature instead of chip and pin...

Which is almost pointless, I never had a signature checked against a card when they were widely used here. A PIN is always checked.

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#198

Post by ultramancool »

premasagar wrote: post #10

Shenanigans like this will only hasten the onset of a bitcoin economy.

It sounds like bullshit, but there's actually some truth to it: when providers of legal services with sketchy uses (I'm talking things like usenet searching, seedboxes, VPNs, scan4you, etc) lose access to PayPal they generally add Bitcoin as at least an option.

It's harder to obtain currency in some of the sketchier webwallets (things like PerfectMoney, WebMoney, etc) and they've been largely replaced with Bitcoin.

Likely because with Bitcoin you don't have to risk a government raid or an allout scam because the payment provider is sketchy (look into Liberty Reserve and Fethard Finance which used to be popular for this purpose).

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#199

Post by scottmmjackson »

cm2187 wrote: post #56
josteink wrote: post #3

> PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as all our customers’ files for illegal content. They have also asked us to provide them with detailed statistics about the files types of our customers sync and share on https://app.seafile.de That's a pretty big WTF right there. I know PayPal has a on overall pretty scummy reputation, but I still I cannot imagine PayPal doing this because they themselves th…

Welcome to the world of financial regulations! You may have not realised but banks and any financial institutions have been deputised by the regulators to be the financial police. They need to ensure that none of their client use financial services to commit crimes or launder the proceeds of a crime, under the penalty of heavy (up to multi billions) fines. Particularly in the US. I am pretty sure this is what is forc…

> They need to ensure that none of their client use financial services to commit crimes

There are also laws that give financial institutions due diligence obligations to ensure they're not facilitating "unsanctioned boycotts".

Re: “PayPal has demanded that we monitor data traffic as well as customers’ files”

#200

Post by ckastner »

mcherm wrote: post #172
cynicalkane wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, at least, AML regulations are whatever the regulators say they are.

I call BS on that. It is true that banks will go a long way to try to satisfy banking regulators. But unless you have some evidence I am simply unwilling to believe that banking regulators can make up any restrictions they like without regard for the actual requirements of federal law.

But unless you have some evidence I am simply unwilling to believe that banking regulators can make up any restrictions they like without regard for the actual requirements of federal law.

The actual requirements of federal law are often (intentionally) formulated on such a high level that in practice, the banking regulator does end up specifying the actual rules.

Say, for example, a federal law requires that banks "take reasonable measures to impede money laundering".

Now what those "reasonable measures" are is usually determined by the overseeing regulator (eg: the SEC). Sure, you can disagree with their assessment, but they'll fine you anyway and then, the best-case scenario is that after X years in court, the fine gets overturned.

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