The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web • Hacker News Board

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#161

Post by kensai » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:02 AM UTC

hiram112 wrote: post #157

Mon_7i wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think privacy/freedom issues are symptoms not root causes. The Internet today allows/has allowed for the rapid extraction of information/wealth from the masses into the hands of a few. I am totally opposed to the propping up of Mark Zuckerburgs and Larry Pages. Who then get to decide who and how the worlds information shall be accessed. This should not be the point of the internet. There are too many unintended con…

>...Trumps and ISIS.... I know election season can make us all a little crazy towards the 'other team', but are you seriously putting Trump in the same camp as ISIS? Hitler, Nazis, etc. have been used so often in the past 50 years by all sides that it is easy to brush it off as empty rhetoric. But if the left has become so blind in their hatred towards Trump, that these comparisons can be made without a second though…

Six hours for Godwin's law. Of course in threads where privacy is concerned this is not a record. :D

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#162

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:10 AM UTC

freshhawk wrote: post #155

Animats wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know it's a rant, but open source people do not know how to do user-friendly user interfaces. A few days ago, I posted the home page links for Diaspora, Gnu Social, and Friendica, and commented "any questions". Blatant UI bugs often don't get fixed in open source. There's a bug in Ubuntu on some machines which causes the cursor to disappear after coming back from a suspend. (You can get the cursor back by typing CT…

Definitely, but I look at it from the direction of "No one has pulled in the good UX/UI people to do open source work" and that's simply a social/culture problem. I also think it's completely fixable, because all the reasons to do open source programming work apply to UI/UX work. Getting your work in front of a lot of people, gaining experience and notoriety, getting to scratch your own itch. There just was no Linux…

Mainly because of culture differences.

Good UX/UI people don't bother to pay for their tools, like in most professions, and prefer to work in software like Photoshop, Illustrator, Sketch, Maya, Poser, you name it instead of constrain themselves to "worse is better" just to feel good.

So in the end, most don't feel the need to join any FOSS community and rather build their portfolio on online design galleries and magazines.

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#163

Post by Joof » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:10 AM UTC

hiram112 wrote: post #157

Mon_7i wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think privacy/freedom issues are symptoms not root causes. The Internet today allows/has allowed for the rapid extraction of information/wealth from the masses into the hands of a few. I am totally opposed to the propping up of Mark Zuckerburgs and Larry Pages. Who then get to decide who and how the worlds information shall be accessed. This should not be the point of the internet. There are too many unintended con…

>...Trumps and ISIS.... I know election season can make us all a little crazy towards the 'other team', but are you seriously putting Trump in the same camp as ISIS? Hitler, Nazis, etc. have been used so often in the past 50 years by all sides that it is easy to brush it off as empty rhetoric. But if the left has become so blind in their hatred towards Trump, that these comparisons can be made without a second though…

Its a bit too far, I agree.

His right wing authoritarian base is a bit terrifying though.

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#164

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:12 AM UTC

jokoon wrote: post #68

Whatever the solution is, I really believe data must be on user's devices, not on proprietary servers. Open source won the battle of software. The next battle will be about data itself. It surely implies very hard problems when it comes to standardization and how data is exchanged. It might involve something like flatbuffers. How data is exchanged, what rights you have on it, how it is made secure, there are no ubiqu…

> Open source won the battle of software. The next battle will be about data itself.

Not on desktop, mobile platforms, powerful IDE tooling at the Xerox PARC level, games.

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#165

Post by iK12 » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:19 AM UTC

hiram112 wrote: post #157

Mon_7i wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think privacy/freedom issues are symptoms not root causes. The Internet today allows/has allowed for the rapid extraction of information/wealth from the masses into the hands of a few. I am totally opposed to the propping up of Mark Zuckerburgs and Larry Pages. Who then get to decide who and how the worlds information shall be accessed. This should not be the point of the internet. There are too many unintended con…

>...Trumps and ISIS.... I know election season can make us all a little crazy towards the 'other team', but are you seriously putting Trump in the same camp as ISIS? Hitler, Nazis, etc. have been used so often in the past 50 years by all sides that it is easy to brush it off as empty rhetoric. But if the left has become so blind in their hatred towards Trump, that these comparisons can be made without a second though…

I think its being referenced because it was brought up at a Facebook Q&A session with Zuckerberg. As in what about the rise of characters in other parts of the world. It's all good that no one is responsible right?

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#166

Post by aboveL4w » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:41 AM UTC

security flaws are racking up like crazy. the dom was designed for the 1990s. it will happen. but its going to be one hard transition. we all know how hard small scale migrations can be. now consider that on the scale of the internet. they need to enforce new password schemas, disable capchats , they are irritating and mak eppp leave and bots get by them anyway, and windows needs to fix their api. you can never fix a bug before someone exploits it, but you design standards that force the user to follow best practices and force tech giants to stop using oaml. vulnerabilities on large traffic sites should be jail time for the person responsible. i may just active my vpn and use tor for now on for everything, compromise my bandwidth to protect my information. btw, im sure all the cloud competition does not share data with affiliates to profit enabling black hat to exploit and use targeting techniques to launch dox attacks against individuals. im not a sec major. just my 2 bytes. also, critical 0 days need an amber alert like system that forces you to change all affected sites.

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#167

Post by aboveL4w » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:41 AM UTC

security flaws are racking up like crazy. the dom was designed for the 1990s. it will happen. but its going to be one hard transition. we all know how hard small scale migrations can be. now consider that on the scale of the internet. they need to enforce new password schemas, disable capchats , they are irritating and mak eppp leave and bots get by them anyway, and windows needs to fix their api. you can never fix a bug before someone exploits it, but you design standards that force the user to follow best practices and force tech giants to stop using oaml. vulnerabilities on large traffic sites should be jail time for the person responsible. i may just active my vpn and use tor for now on for everything, compromise my bandwidth to protect my information. btw, im sure all the cloud competition does not share data with affiliates to profit enabling black hat to exploit and use targeting techniques to launch dox attacks against individuals. im not a sec major. just my 2 bytes. also, critical 0 days need an amber alert like system that forces you to change all affected sites.

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#168

Post by LukeB42 » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 7:46 AM UTC

LukeB42 wrote: post #2

https://github.com/psybernetics/synchrony I'm working on something else right now but when it's feature complete I'll port synchrony to Go. The plan is to give full consideration to potential pitfalls of multiple overlay networks, the contacts list, and of course peer-to-peer streaming hypermedia. "ENABLE_WEB_APP" is also going to be a configfile option. Users should also be able to modify a list of domains they won'…

Addendum: Identity is a first-class concept when it comes to decentralised HTTP/2.

What we're looking at is Users in a shared channel applying functions to a synchronised tree, when it comes to edits. That's exciting to reason about.

Forget replicating frames, p2p live broadcasts and storing references to edits of hyperdocuments in a DHT for just a second though.

When it comes to identity we'll keep it simple and use the SHA1 of an ip, port and public key. This prevents people generating the node ID that corresponds to google.com at will, in principle.

As a user of the software implementing this protocol you can be identified as network_name/node_id/uuid4, where your contacts can alias that address with a username or you can transmit the nickname you want to be seen as alongside an avatar image.

The idea is to then facilitate a server/browser contacts API. You're a peer node. You're willing to transact with other people who're caching hypermedia either indefinitely or for a minute or so for a live broadcast. What needs exporting is the API for contacts list operations (JavaScript class and thoroughly documented stream RPCs) so developers and entrenched entities can implement chat, webrtc teleconferencing etc on top of this simply by introducing the functioning hypermedia into the DHT for retrieval. It shouldn't matter whether the original host serves the resource.

For example G+, Twitter, Facebook and Skype et al. could introduce their own particular index.html and client.js which execute a single-page app for utilising their silo'd contacts data/news feeds etc. Permitting them granular access to your decentralised contacts list.

I'm willing to discuss this via luke.brooks42 [at] gmail.com if anyone would like to support the development of this project.

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#169

Post by zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 8:23 AM UTC

hiram112 wrote: post #157

Mon_7i wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think privacy/freedom issues are symptoms not root causes. The Internet today allows/has allowed for the rapid extraction of information/wealth from the masses into the hands of a few. I am totally opposed to the propping up of Mark Zuckerburgs and Larry Pages. Who then get to decide who and how the worlds information shall be accessed. This should not be the point of the internet. There are too many unintended con…

>...Trumps and ISIS.... I know election season can make us all a little crazy towards the 'other team', but are you seriously putting Trump in the same camp as ISIS? Hitler, Nazis, etc. have been used so often in the past 50 years by all sides that it is easy to brush it off as empty rhetoric. But if the left has become so blind in their hatred towards Trump, that these comparisons can be made without a second though…

I am not taking a position on that, but have you asked yourself under which circumstances you would accept a comparison with Hitler as valid? Or do you think that something like Hitler could never happen again, and therefore, the comparison cannot ever by appropriate again? If so, why?

Re: The Fathers of the Internet Urge Today’s Software Engineers to Reinvent the Web

#170

Post by zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC » Mon, Jun 20, 2016, 8:28 AM UTC

brokenmachine wrote: post #120

paganel wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Zooko threw cold water on everybody ("Is this just 1999 again?") I have all the respect in the world for people like Vint Cerf, but the fact that he mentioned "copyright" and "intellectual property" twice in his list of otherwise quite interesting proposals make me doubtful about "1999" ever making a come-back. (I personally view the 1999-2005 or so period as a "good" one for the Internet, all of the dreams of that…

Google built its business and its current $500+ billion status on stealing other websites' content and storing it on their servers. Can't anyone exclude their pages from being scraped by google if they so desire? If you post something on a site that allows itself to be scraped, only then it will go on google.

Practically, you can't, because Google has a quasi-monopoly on attention.