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Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

nytimes.com

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Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#21

Post by WildUtah »

eli wrote: post #4
cperciva wrote: post #3

she used the app Nurx for birth control because she felt uncomfortable visiting a doctor Frankly, this terrifies me. Getting medication which is generally accepted to be mostly safe from a pharmacy because it's cheaper and more convenient than seeing a doctor, sure. But if you're not comfortable seeing a doctor... you should probably be seeing a doctor.

Agreed, though I was under the impression that the reasons birth control still requires a prescription is not entirely based in science.

Public health bureaucrats are trying to eliminate birth control pills and making them available over the counter won't help that goal. That's science.

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#22

Post by maxerickson »

ars wrote: post #19
maxerickson wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure I read what you wrote. The line you quoted With nearly 40 percent of all pregnancies in the United States unintended, birth control is a critical public health issue. isn't claiming birth control is 100% effective, it's saying that there are a lot of people that might benefit from access. I posted what I posted because I didn't think it was particularly misleading for the article to state a fact that was importa…

> it's saying that there are a lot of people that might benefit from access. Not as many as you would think. The number of people who: 1. want birth control, 2. are unable to get it, 3. had an child as a result, 4. and would have preferred not to, is a much smaller number than the article makes it out to be. I find that misleading. I don't know why you don't. These apps are about saving time for people, they will do…

Because 2. doesn't have to be true for the access to still be important.

I mean, go ask someone on birth control if maintaining access is important to them.

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#23

Post by cperciva »

niftich wrote: post #14
cperciva wrote: post #3

she used the app Nurx for birth control because she felt uncomfortable visiting a doctor Frankly, this terrifies me. Getting medication which is generally accepted to be mostly safe from a pharmacy because it's cheaper and more convenient than seeing a doctor, sure. But if you're not comfortable seeing a doctor... you should probably be seeing a doctor.

From the article: "But the new websites and apps could reach many more women. They require no legislative approval since clinicians still write the prescriptions. The ventures must follow telemedicine regulations, which vary by state, and can only prescribe in states where their clinicians are licensed." They are technically seeing a doctor (via telemedicine), but aren't comfortable to do so in person. This enables t…

They are technically seeing a doctor

Sure, and "medical marijuana" dispensaries technically require that you get diagnosed with something which marijuana can be used to treat.

When doctors are being paid by a company which sells the product they're prescribing, I lack confidence in their ability to render medical opinions in the patients' best interest.

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#24

Post by guelo »

ars wrote: post #11

"With nearly 40 percent of all pregnancies in the United States unintended, birth control is a critical public health issue." But check the actual source and: "Among women who had unintended births in the United States in 1998–2002, about 40% were using contraception" So that's very misleading reporting. Note that they tracked women for 4 years - track someone for their entire life and the numbers who had at least on…

"Contraception" in those CDC questionnaires includes all methods including the withdrawal method, rhythm, condoms, pill, vasectomy, etc. You can't really draw a conclusion about the effectiveness of any particular method from that study. Effectiveness per method data is available, though I can't figure out what argument it is that you're trying to make so forcefully. Things like IUD and implants are >99%/year effective.

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#25

Post by Asparagirl »

tcj_phx wrote: post #18
Asparagirl wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but hundreds of millions of women also bounce around between different types of hormonal birth control (variations in pill type versus Depo shots versus NuvaRing versus Mirena versus the patch, etc.) because they have miserable experiences with physical and/or emotional side effects. I know this is anecdata, but I know two different young healthy women who suffered strokes or Deep Vein Thrombosis before the age…

> I know this is anecdata, but I know two different young healthy women who suffered strokes or Deep Vein Thrombosis before the age of thirty because of Yaz. (Both fully recovered, thank God, but will never be able to take hormonal pills again for life.) The cause/effect relationship between elevated estrogen levels and clotting disorders is well understood by physiologists. All the old high-estrogen contraceptive pi…

Well understood now, yes, but Yaz was heavily marketed to young women as being the latest and greatest thing on the market, and it passed FDA approval and came from major manufacturers -- yet it didn't get pulled off the shelves until 2011, after many deaths and strokes.

I support women having easier access to birth control, but my point is that even today, this stuff has a different safety profile than, like, Pepto Bismol or Advil.

(But then again, so does Tylenol, and that's legal, so...)

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#26

Post by jessaustin »

cperciva wrote: post #7
tn13 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What she wants to do is her business. If she wants to use an app or a voodoo magician for health I frankly think it is no body's business to tell her otherwise. Even third world countries have birth control off the shelf.

That's the strict Libertarian view, yes. The consensus among medical ethicists, however, is that medical professionals have a duty to avoid allowing patients to come to harm, and that this duty takes priority even over the patient's wishes; wanting to cut your arm off may be your own business, but you won't find a surgeon offering to sell you tools for that purpose.

You seem here to blur the distinction between "women can't expect physicians or pharmacists to give them birth control with certain side effects" and "women can't get birth control with certain side effects".

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#27

Post by criley2 »

cperciva wrote: post #23
niftich wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the article: "But the new websites and apps could reach many more women. They require no legislative approval since clinicians still write the prescriptions. The ventures must follow telemedicine regulations, which vary by state, and can only prescribe in states where their clinicians are licensed." They are technically seeing a doctor (via telemedicine), but aren't comfortable to do so in person. This enables t…

They are technically seeing a doctor Sure, and "medical marijuana" dispensaries technically require that you get diagnosed with something which marijuana can be used to treat. When doctors are being paid by a company which sells the product they're prescribing, I lack confidence in their ability to render medical opinions in the patients' best interest.

Hey, no, ok, I work in the medical software field (EHR provider who has a number of telehealth options) and the comparison of telemedicine to a dispensary or a pill mill is offensive and ignorant.

Telehealth is extremely effective in a number of cases, generally with the elderly and those with anxiety issues. It's very very cost effective, provides some of the best clinical data on patients empowering better diagnosis and care, and keeps patients engaged.

It is not some profit-fueled sham like a pill mill or a legal trick around the criminalization of marijuana, it is a legitimate technological advancement in achieving better care for more people.

Hell, we're seeing that using telehealth in conjunction with traditional office services creates a lot more successful outcomes than office care alone as people remain engaged in their care plan!

The idea that telehealth is inadequate for birth control prescription is a bit silly to me, do you have any rational reasons against this technology and paradigm or just fear mongering comparisons like dispensary?

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#28

Post by DanBC »

ars wrote: post #19
maxerickson wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure I read what you wrote. The line you quoted With nearly 40 percent of all pregnancies in the United States unintended, birth control is a critical public health issue. isn't claiming birth control is 100% effective, it's saying that there are a lot of people that might benefit from access. I posted what I posted because I didn't think it was particularly misleading for the article to state a fact that was importa…

> it's saying that there are a lot of people that might benefit from access. Not as many as you would think. The number of people who: 1. want birth control, 2. are unable to get it, 3. had an child as a result, 4. and would have preferred not to, is a much smaller number than the article makes it out to be. I find that misleading. I don't know why you don't. These apps are about saving time for people, they will do…

You said:

> "With nearly 40 percent of all pregnancies in the United States unintended, birth control is a critical public health issue."

> But check the actual source and:

And maxericson quoted the actual source, which says

> Results—About 37% of births in the United States were unintended at the time of conception.

It seems the report accurately quoted the abstract, and so I'm confused why you think it didn't.

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#29

Post by drumdance »

cperciva wrote: post #23
niftich wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the article: "But the new websites and apps could reach many more women. They require no legislative approval since clinicians still write the prescriptions. The ventures must follow telemedicine regulations, which vary by state, and can only prescribe in states where their clinicians are licensed." They are technically seeing a doctor (via telemedicine), but aren't comfortable to do so in person. This enables t…

They are technically seeing a doctor Sure, and "medical marijuana" dispensaries technically require that you get diagnosed with something which marijuana can be used to treat. When doctors are being paid by a company which sells the product they're prescribing, I lack confidence in their ability to render medical opinions in the patients' best interest.

Birth control, unlike marijuana, has no recreational use.

Re: Birth Control via App Finds Footing Under Political Radar

#30

Post by WA »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #10
tcj_phx wrote: post #2

There is a problem with birth control that the media doesn't like to talk about. While millions of women take birth control, almost all of them eventually (or immediately) hate the side effects. So most women take these awful drugs only because they are seen as the best way to prevent pregnancy. Cruising over to reddit's /r/birthcontrol now, this submission was from 16 hours ago: > So because I was losing hair after…

Hundreds of millions also take those without negative side-effects.

Unfortunately, that headache, migraine, loss of sex drive, yeast infections, increased blood pressure and so on are often thought to be "normal". So many side effects are accepted as a fact of life and hormonal contraceptives as the source to those side effects is widely ignored. By both, women and doctors unfortunately.
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