Ethereum/DAO would be much less of a tire fire embarassment if the management had taken some time to learn anything about the basics of contracts and law, instead of making it up as they go and assuming the entirety of centuries of civilization has no clue what they were doing.
They were indeed very naive. In the history of law, there has always been a divide between those who believe that the letter of law should be applied no matter what, and those who believe that social justice should be ensured. Whatever the terms of theDAO, there WILL be judges to find that what just happened to it is theft. That is why instead of damaging trust in Ether by forking it, the ethereum/DAO management shou…
Thinking About Smart Contract Security
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Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#42It's a complete aberration that the Ethereum Foundation is even considering pushing a fork (hard or soft). There will be a fork, that is people leaving "Ethereum" for its new shiny successor. If you want the protection of a big brother, why not invest in the regular stock market? Lots of neophytes trying to get rich quick are now crying for help after realizing they made a mistake. It's really touching.
Ethereum is not trustable if there is rollback when a contract didn't operate as intended. Can you imagine the stock market operating this way?
BTW has bitcoin ever had a rollback in its existence?
Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you know you're giving money to a ponzi scheme and see all the rules of it, is it really a ponzi scheme/gullibility? It sounds just as interesting as betting on sports / stockmarket / ... People still play roulette or blackjack, even though they know they're guaranteed to lose in a long run / on average.
A ponzi scheme that calls itself a ponzi scheme is still illegal.
Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#44It's a complete aberration that the Ethereum Foundation is even considering pushing a fork (hard or soft). There will be a fork, that is people leaving "Ethereum" for its new shiny successor. If you want the protection of a big brother, why not invest in the regular stock market? Lots of neophytes trying to get rich quick are now crying for help after realizing they made a mistake. It's really touching.
Any time there is a bug in a smart contract, do we get roll back in Ethereum? There will be more smart contract bugs or operations against intent. I think this is going to become a joke. Ethereum is not trustable if there is rollback when a contract didn't operate as intended. Can you imagine the stock market operating this way? BTW has bitcoin ever had a rollback in its existence?
Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#45Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#46> The terms of The DAO Creation are set forth in the smart contract code existing on the Ethereum blockchain at 0xbb9bc244d798123fde783fcc1c72d3bb8c189413. Nothing in this explanation of terms or in any other document or communication may modify or add any additional obligations or guarantees beyond those set forth in The DAO’s code.
That document is the single link that connects the Ethereum toy world with the world of real, legally enforceable contracts. If any court actually takes that clause seriously and treats the DAO code as legally binding terms of service, I think that could have two consequences:
1) Intent: The terms written on the website don't say anything about crowdfunding, voting processes or the supposed purpose of the DAO. They do however say very clearly "the code is the law" and even point out that this will cause risks for the investors, should the code contain bugs.
That writing IMO makes the current argument that the attacker violated the "intent" of the contract very hard to argue.
2) Contract amendmends: As far as I know (as a layman), legal contracts may only changed of all affected parties agree to the change. Therefore, if the DAO code should be treated as a legal contract, you could interpret the soft fork as an amendment - even though not all of the DAO token holders were asked for agreement. In the most extreme case, the attacker could sue and demand that his "theft" is cashed out, even if the soft/hard fork proposal is accepted.
Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#47IANAL, but I think what might turn out most problematic for TheDAO in the end is not the soft fork/hard fork proposal or even the loss of trust, but their - often quoted - own terms of service[1]: > The terms of The DAO Creation are set forth in the smart contract code existing on the Ethereum blockchain at 0xbb9bc244d798123fde783fcc1c72d3bb8c189413. Nothing in this explanation of terms or in any other document or co…
DAO token holders can express their agreement or disagreement by choosing which fork they want to attach to.
Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#48Why not restrict the entire language instead of trying to verify that a program fits into a safe subset? What practical uses are there for general recursion and unbounded gas usage in the context of smart contracts (not to mention multiple inheritance, inline bytecode assembly, and the many other complex features of Solidity)?
Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#49Re: Thinking About Smart Contract Security
#50I have no idea WTF is going on here. I've tried to search around for a clue but the more I read the more confusing it gets.
At first it seemed that Ethereum was a kind of cryptocurrency like bitcoin (something that people could "mine" and exchange), then something about "contracts" that don't require trust, then something about it being effectively "a computer" that never stops, an investment system investing in something no one ever actually names, some story about a hack that drains ether out of the system.
And now this story which has words like... "Governmental", "Rock-paper-scissors", "Casino", fees "stolen" because of constructor bug, "ponzi".
Even forgetting all the confusing jargon, I can't come up with a mental model that makes any sense at all. Is this just an elaborate puzzle game for geniuses? Or are people making and losing real money with this? By "money" I mean something that can be converted into actual US dollars right now and stored in a bank.