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American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

theatlantic.com

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Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#161

Post by yummyfajitas »

MawNicker wrote: post #83
x5n1 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the end of the day say that you paid everyone the same amount of money regardless of whether they worked or did not. And there was no additional way to make money. Maybe there was an additional barter economy where you could work for things that you could then trade for other things. How would that change things. Because now no one would have to work and would only do things if they wanted to do them. And everyone…

> Where everyone literally has the same power over everyone else I'm sympathetic to these sorts of ideals. I think you've gone too far though. I want Elon Musk to be able to exist. The working world is a lot shittier than it needs to be. It's the ultimate buyer's market. The masses are forced to sell their labor under penalty of death. The owners, however benevolent, know this. They design our jobs with it in the bac…

It's the ultimate buyer's market. The masses are forced to sell their labor under penalty of death.

In that case, how come millions of non-workers aren't dead?

[edit: to clarify, I mean in the US and similar western countries.]

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#162

Post by mtbcoder »

smt88 wrote: post #136
tempestn wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Deep ingrained anti-intellectualism, idolization of stupidity and love of the brazen and the rich. You're saying Donald Trump's support is evidence against those things? It seems like exactly the opposite to me, on all counts.

My sentence wasn't very clear. When I was talking about Trump and Sanders, I was referring only to the idolization of the rich. Both Trump and Sanders spoke out against the wealthy elite controlling politics. Trump even rejected partisan campaign financing until recently.

One of the biggest culture shocks I had when I first moved to the US was the near constant push of consumerism and celebration of consumption. I had never seen or experienced this before at such high levels and even 15 years or so later, I still cannot come to grips with it (although I am a bit more desensitized to it). It permeates every aspect of American life and is quite difficult to escape. Perhaps this is a bad cliche, but the average American's status here is very much defined by his or her ability to consume. Americans may sneer more at the 1%, but idolization of being rich has never decelerated.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#163

Post by Spooky23 »

guscost wrote: post #43

I'm a huge fan of Mike Rowe. He's done some amazing journalism with "Dirty Jobs" and his mikeroweWORKS foundation is terrific. He claims that unconditional encouragement toward intellectual dreams does not help most people, and argues that more kids should be pursuing professional trades. This overlaps with one of the better suggestions from this article. In general I think these are hit or miss, and maybe too academ…

Absolutely.

The billable rate for journeyman auto mechanics is $100/hr. Simultaneously, we have a massive and growing glut of trained attorneys earning nothing.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#164

Post by type0 »

jackgavigan wrote: post #4

A meritoracy can reward qualities other than intelligence - integrity, talent, dedication, diligence, courage (both physical and moral), kindness, generosity, willingness to help others...

There really is no meritocracy as such it is just the other name for elitocracy, you know the buddy society that favors corruption. In academia the merits are often not assigned objectively even in hard sciences, If you think that everything is based on merits, everything becomes a merit, knowing some famous professor becomes a merit regardless that is because your uncle is his friend. And don't get me started on the elitocracy in politics and other institutions.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#165

Post by DanielBMarkham »

guscost wrote: post #43

I'm a huge fan of Mike Rowe. He's done some amazing journalism with "Dirty Jobs" and his mikeroweWORKS foundation is terrific. He claims that unconditional encouragement toward intellectual dreams does not help most people, and argues that more kids should be pursuing professional trades. This overlaps with one of the better suggestions from this article. In general I think these are hit or miss, and maybe too academ…

Tangential, but related: I don't know Mike Rowe's work that much, nor do I follow him. But a few friends over the last year or two have shared some of his social posts and essays.

Dang. The guy can write. If the rest of his work is of the same quality as his seemingly off-the-cuff social stuff, he's worth paying attention to.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#167

Post by zizzles »

Are you guys living in the same world that I am?

Nerdy geek-type intellectuals are at the BOTTOM of the totem pole in terms of respect and human worth in the 21st century. They are ostracized, bullied in school, most are awkward virgins (intellect is the anti-thesis when it comes to being a "womanizer" or "stud") and it's only getting worse as society progresses.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#168

Post by [deleted] »

zizzles wrote: post #167

Are you guys living in the same world that I am? Nerdy geek-type intellectuals are at the BOTTOM of the totem pole in terms of respect and human worth in the 21st century. They are ostracized, bullied in school, most are awkward virgins (intellect is the anti-thesis when it comes to being a "womanizer" or "stud") and it's only getting worse as society progresses.

[deleted]

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#169

Post by rms_returns »

zizzles wrote: post #167

Are you guys living in the same world that I am? Nerdy geek-type intellectuals are at the BOTTOM of the totem pole in terms of respect and human worth in the 21st century. They are ostracized, bullied in school, most are awkward virgins (intellect is the anti-thesis when it comes to being a "womanizer" or "stud") and it's only getting worse as society progresses.

You are absolutely correct. The ones that get the most worth and respect are actually the middlemen who are good communicators between the "geeky" types and the zero knowledge "corporate" types. Whether the middlemen deserve it or not, I don't know but such are the things in the real world.

In an IT company, for instance, you will always find the project managers and even supervisors getting all the glory and respect whereas the programmers and architects are shunned on the side.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#170

Post by [deleted] »

zizzles wrote: post #167

Are you guys living in the same world that I am? Nerdy geek-type intellectuals are at the BOTTOM of the totem pole in terms of respect and human worth in the 21st century. They are ostracized, bullied in school, most are awkward virgins (intellect is the anti-thesis when it comes to being a "womanizer" or "stud") and it's only getting worse as society progresses.

[deleted]
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