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PHP Sucks

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Re: PHP Sucks

#151

Post by ransom1538 »

kreeves wrote: post #141
ransom1538 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I graduated in 2003. I haven't been able to stop coding php. Why? Because of the amount of work . I know other languages, but the pay for php these days is totally astronomical. (I live in sf, pacific-heights / WELLL over 6 figs / wife doesn't work). Currently I feel like I have a massive technical advantage (I wont share). Right now I work on iphone/android backends - at massive scale, top 10 (PHP is fast). When peo…

I've mostly tried to fight the anti-PHP movement because I WANT new developers to come on board and create great things. I want new packages to pop-up as soon as some new tool/api/widget becomes available. I've felt for quite some time that most of the anti-PHP sentiment is an effort of other developers to justify the language they've selected to focus on. "Yeah, I'm doing Javascript and Node.js and yeah it's got it'…

I disagree. Wanting to get new grads into PHP is bizarre. They would be ostracized. They don't have the technical experience to know WHY it is a good language (CI/unit testing/years of libraries/API support in everything/bla bla). They should be working on things that are new and untested. That is what a twenty something should be working on. Check please?

Re: PHP Sucks

#152

Post by krapp »

gear54rus wrote: post #127
trebor wrote: post #85

I started freelancing in my area doing Ruby on Rails, and found it far harder to maintain a project. I also found it harder to acquire clients in my area for new RoR development. More work was available locally with PHP. Clients were more willing to pay. I've done a ton of things in WordPress that shouldn't have been, "to save money". And I've done greenfield development with CodeIgniter, Laravel (v3 and v5), and a c…

> More often it's the programmer who sucks, not the language. Catchphrase so ironic I laugh every time I hear it. The language also is written by a programmer, who sucked in PHP's case IMO.

>The language also is written by a programmer, who sucked in PHP's case IMO.

    Yes, I am a terrible coder, but I am probably still better than you :) 
    
    - Rasmus Lerdorf
Modern PHP is written and maintained by a team of programmers. It hasn't been the language Rasmus wrote (badly, as a hack he never intended anyone else to use) for years.

Re: PHP Sucks

#153

Post by Gigablah »

ryanlm wrote: post #124
staticelf wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to like Laravel, but lately it feels so enterprisy. There is a lot of boilerplate in Laravel today and it was changing too fast for me to keep up with it.

If I were to build enterprise software in PHP, I'd use Zend Framework. Not sure why it's not as popular.

Probably because if you're using Zend Framework, you might as well go all the way and just use Java Spring.

Re: PHP Sucks

#154

Post by willejs »

segmondy wrote: post #142
willejs wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

| More often it's the programmer who sucks, not the language. Whilst it is possible to write structured, elegant php, its very hard, and thats the languages fault. The barrier to entry to write bad PHP is very low, thats what makes people think it 'sucks', because 90% of PHP codebases do. :(

It's not hard to write structured elegant php, that is horseshit. Please look at code for symfony or laravel. Hell, my annoyance with writing good code in PHP is that it ends up looking like Java, which begs the question, why not just do it in java. https://github.com/symfony/symfony/tree/master/src/Symfony or you can look at simpler sample codes I wrote for a class in design patterns with php https://github.com/segm…

Your right, its not hard, but it is on the scale of how easy it is to write bad php.

Re: PHP Sucks

#155

Post by mordocai »

SadWebDeveloper wrote: post #123

While RoR, Python, NodeJS et al don't solve the most annoying issue for every developer: Deployment. Then they don't solve anything. And don't start talking about docker... that's a patch/hack to a serious problem, if i need an entire "jail manager" just to run your app then deployment is not as easy as you kins think it is.

You should be running PHP in a jail as well though. People just don't.

Re: PHP Sucks

#156

Post by vesak »

kreeves wrote: post #141
ransom1538 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I graduated in 2003. I haven't been able to stop coding php. Why? Because of the amount of work . I know other languages, but the pay for php these days is totally astronomical. (I live in sf, pacific-heights / WELLL over 6 figs / wife doesn't work). Currently I feel like I have a massive technical advantage (I wont share). Right now I work on iphone/android backends - at massive scale, top 10 (PHP is fast). When peo…

I've mostly tried to fight the anti-PHP movement because I WANT new developers to come on board and create great things. I want new packages to pop-up as soon as some new tool/api/widget becomes available. I've felt for quite some time that most of the anti-PHP sentiment is an effort of other developers to justify the language they've selected to focus on. "Yeah, I'm doing Javascript and Node.js and yeah it's got it'…

>I've felt for quite some time that most of the anti-PHP sentiment is an effort of other developers to justify the language they've selected to focus on.

Would you be surprised if I told you that pro-PHP sentiment looks exactly like that as well?

Re: PHP Sucks

#157

Post by vesak »

trebor wrote: post #85

I started freelancing in my area doing Ruby on Rails, and found it far harder to maintain a project. I also found it harder to acquire clients in my area for new RoR development. More work was available locally with PHP. Clients were more willing to pay. I've done a ton of things in WordPress that shouldn't have been, "to save money". And I've done greenfield development with CodeIgniter, Laravel (v3 and v5), and a c…

>I'm very tired of hearing that PHP sucks. PHP is a good language

And I'm quite tired of hearing this silly, totally meritless defense in every single thread that discusses PHP. Can't we just agree that it's not a very good language, but people are still doing cool stuff and lots of money with it? So many pointless fights could be averted like this.

Re: PHP Sucks

#158

Post by smileysteve »

trebor wrote: post #85

I started freelancing in my area doing Ruby on Rails, and found it far harder to maintain a project. I also found it harder to acquire clients in my area for new RoR development. More work was available locally with PHP. Clients were more willing to pay. I've done a ton of things in WordPress that shouldn't have been, "to save money". And I've done greenfield development with CodeIgniter, Laravel (v3 and v5), and a c…

> More often it's the programmer who sucks, not the language.

In the context, it's also a common occurrence that I can tell when developers came from the php (non framework) world. When I see them move to Rails (or in javascript), I often see an obvious lack of understanding / adaptation of MVC, Single Responsibility, asynchronicity, testing, and variable scoping - I've seen Senior PHP Developers come out with less of these concepts than codeschool graduates.

That's not to say that PHP has this, or that every Rails/JS developer writes tests and understands these things (it still confounds me how companies choose rails and don't implement any tests, despite testing being a core idea)..

Re: PHP Sucks

#159

Post by edem »

trebor wrote: post #85

I started freelancing in my area doing Ruby on Rails, and found it far harder to maintain a project. I also found it harder to acquire clients in my area for new RoR development. More work was available locally with PHP. Clients were more willing to pay. I've done a ton of things in WordPress that shouldn't have been, "to save money". And I've done greenfield development with CodeIgniter, Laravel (v3 and v5), and a c…

Have you ever heard of the Blub paradox? [1]

[1][http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?BlubParadox]

Re: PHP Sucks

#160

Post by untilHellbanned »

rplnt wrote: post #68
serg_chernata wrote: post #55

Can we just stop with these posts? It's like saying "ice cream sucks". That's just like, your opinion man.

> That's just like, your opinion man. I don't think you can argue it's just an opinion. I haven't seen anyone argue that php isn't badly designed or implemented. Other than stating that it works and you can work around it.

I think PHP is well designed and implemented. I like it working with it. So yes, let's please stop.
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