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Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

nytimes.com

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Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#141

Post by awinder »

_audakel wrote: post #76
awinder wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These companies depress wages for the people that live & work in the US though, not just for the people they displace. The downstream effects on the places impacted mean this is a consequence that ripples through communities of people who live in and support their nation of residence.

Foreign workers (fw) who work for less $ than the Domestic worker (dw) drive down wages. In this case fw is benefited by making more than they would in native country, while dw makes less than the old rate. Paying old rate generally means dw keeps old rate, while fw makes nothing. This is the inverse where the dw is benefited at the expense of the fw. If all people are equal who should recieve the benift?

What's the utility to people in dw society of providing benefits to fw? This has happened across broad industries and dw through their governments have signed trade deals that usually include retraining for the workers affected. Otherwise, dw and their governments end up subsidizing the costs of corporations making bank which has so little social benefit that it's really not normal to allow it to go on.

It's not a free for all in places like India to allow fw to displace their dw or drive down their dw salaries. The US is getting taken for a ride with these policies.

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#142

Post by xeropho »

Immigration for "skilled" workers is flawed in US Please look at other countries ( point based system ) and for the love of sanity just adopt best practices ... flaws: 1) Skilled worker immigration should be based on "skills" (country of origin is incorrect: Indian and Chinese immigrants suffer, US workforce also suffers) 2) Immigration should be tied to individuals, influence from employer has conflict of interest. (employer wants to make money even if it comes at the cost of employees ability to immigrate) 3) Immigration as whole should be based on what new individuals bring to the table (skills, age when joining workforce, true intent and ability to adopt new country)

Point 3 is complex and involves true value for US or country of adoption. * Immigration overall is not as complex or difficult as most politicians publicize it, it has become far more political than it needs to be, thank you President Obama.

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#143

Post by ap3 »

dclowd9901 wrote: post #80
nwhybrid wrote: post #77

As a former H1-B worker myself (please put down the pitch-forks :)), I can tell you that regular companies aren't hiring H1-Bs to replace you directly. Instead they contract swarms of us through companies like WiPro and other body shops. This, along with the inability to seek a more fitting job on your own regardless of skill level is the main problem I see. You're essentially shackled to these body shops. You can't…

Is it a common reaction to raise pitchforks at H1-B's? I mostly feel sorry for workers on visa. They don't have the flexibility I do to change jobs if they're not happy. That would be the absolute worst for me, as someone who is always looking for a better gig.

Most of us/them are not in bad situations. I was H1B and it was great - stressful during the downturns, but better off than not coming here.

Scammers will prey on those with less chance to make it.

Edit: btw, when things got bad at my sponsor company I was able to get another company to sponsor, transfered my H1B and continued the GC process.

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#144

Post by muhfuhkuh »

I find it interesting the amount of sudden vitriol by some of the formerly "free market" supporters that thought that the terrible job market for non-STEM majors would never, ever hit the technology industry. Those that decry artistry and creative industry jobs as beneath them and their money, those that felt working class people were just too lazy to find "good" jobs, and generally feeling apathy if not schadenfreude for those suffering from the corporate recovery of 2010-present.

Those same free marketers also agreed with the destruction of unions and protections like minimum wage. Now that the shoe is on the other foot, look at the comments. "H1-Bs are depressing prices" have replaced "why should I pay for music and movies" and "any industry that relies on ads should die".

Well, now with the tables turned, why should working class Americans and artists and content creators give one shit that the technology industry is suffering from "depressed salaries". Suffer with the rest of America.

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#145

Post by andrei_says_ »

yuhong wrote: post #3

I am not surprised that companies that are broken enough to do the outsourcing in the first place are also often broken enough to have this term in severance agreements. But it really should not be standard.

Company lawyers think of maximizing the company's power and safety in every contract. If the clause is not illegal and improves that equation, it'll be standard.

Morality notwithstanding.

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#147

Post by [deleted] »

nopzor wrote: post #139
brendangregg wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not supposed to be true, but take the company who is making threats to have their employees deported if they complain or leave.

Couldn't they make sure to transfer their h1b before they resigned from their old job? (And not threaten or complain until the transfer is processed successfully?)

[deleted]

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#148

Post by brendangregg »

nopzor wrote: post #139
brendangregg wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not supposed to be true, but take the company who is making threats to have their employees deported if they complain or leave.

Couldn't they make sure to transfer their h1b before they resigned from their old job? (And not threaten or complain until the transfer is processed successfully?)

With the IANAL caveat: that helps prevent one type of employee abuse, the "retaliation termination" intended to force an ex-employee out of the country rather than starting their new job. (Which is also the reason why a visa worker who is waiting on the H-1B "transfer" is advised by immigration lawyers not to tell their current employer that they are thinking of leaving, no matter how much they want to.) But, that's just one situation.

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#149

Post by tamana »

dominotw wrote: post #38
_audakel wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> disposable foreign workers are brought over to get exploited "exploited" is a matter of perspective. To an onlooker who has lived their whole life in a first world country, seeing people work for $x - (less-significantlyLess) [where $x is what is "typical" for the job] can be seen as bad/wrong/sad etc... I have spent time working in very poor parts of Mexico and Manila. Crime is rampant, I feared for my life at tim…

I am an immigrant living in the united states. I still can't believe my luck that I get to live in this paradise on earth called USA. I also feel guilty that got this incredible opportunity while much of my extended family and friends rot in third world hell holes waiting for their lives to be over quickly so they can be put out of their misery. One of my uncle works as day laborer in dubai. He works 14 hr days of ha…

What's the point? Why have children if one's best opportunity to support them is to go be a slave in Dubai?

Re: Laid-Off Americans, Required to Zip Lips on Way Out, Grow Bolder

#150

Post by tamana »

JorgeGT wrote: post #78
mschuster91 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably India or Pakistan, common sources of Dubai slave labor.

I'm guessing India because of the karma comment. What here in HN is a number on your profile, there it is a promise of a better future (but maybe in the next life).

A false promise.
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