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What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

nytimes.com

21–30 of 108 posts

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#21
post #3

I can certainly believe that there is more going on than just stress, and the argument that compression waves travelling through the brain can damage it is pretty compelling. The question then is how would you block it? How would you protect yourself from a compression (blast) wave such that it went "around" your head rather than through it. Is there some material that could conduct that energy preferentially?

Stop sending people to war would help

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#22
post #12

With a background in philosophy and neuroscience, I cringe at articles like this drawing a distinction psychological and physical. They are simply the same thing.

>They are simply the same thing.

This is not the accepted wisdom on the subject. The accepted wisdom is: "we don't have any evidence that these things are separate, so for now, while the jury is still out, we consider psychological and physical well-being to be equivalent".

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#23
post #21
post #3

I can certainly believe that there is more going on than just stress, and the argument that compression waves travelling through the brain can damage it is pretty compelling. The question then is how would you block it? How would you protect yourself from a compression (blast) wave such that it went "around" your head rather than through it. Is there some material that could conduct that energy preferentially?

Stop sending people to war would help

True, although I'm also concerned about people who are in the area when a bomb goes off (and there has been way too much of that lately). How much does damage? Is the damage reparable? What how far away must you be? If not reparable then treatable? The big data point here is the actual injury, vs the psychological injury.

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#25

A historical quibble with the article, It was first known as shell shock, then combat fatigue and finally PTSD, and in each case, it was almost universally understood as a psychic rather than a physical affliction. This underplays a pretty significant history of doctors considering it a physical condition, as the old name "shell shock" itself suggests. The article does mention one such doctor, Fredrick Mott, but ther…

The article covers this: there were those who suggested physical causes, but they were, quite literally, out of fashion: Cf the article's mention of the, in this case, possibly incorrect and ultimately distracting influence of Freudians and other proponents of non-conscious, non-physical causes.

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#26
I found this article interesting but frustrating. Conflating PTSD (a mental illness that is caused by traumatic experience) with concussive traumatic brain injury isn't helpful.

I kept thinking it would be more interesting (and aligned to the headline) to look at PTSD sufferers brains when they didn't have a known physical injury to their brains.

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#27
post #16
post #12

With a background in philosophy and neuroscience, I cringe at articles like this drawing a distinction psychological and physical. They are simply the same thing.

Do you debug your code with a microscope and soldering iron? Layers of abstraction are useful, especially when we don't fully understand how the hardware works.

Yes, this. Exactly what I wanted to add.

One day, perhaps, we will understand how all the layers interact well enough. But until then, we need the descriptive and diagnostic and prescriptive techniques provided by those abstractions.

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#28
post #4

What if not only PTSD but all psychological phenomena were, by their very nature, rooted in the physical chemistry of the brain? How bizarre would that be?

Even if it were like that, things like the gut-brain connection (or rather, interaction) would destroy all hope for a neat separation of brain vs the rest.

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#29

I found this article interesting but frustrating. Conflating PTSD (a mental illness that is caused by traumatic experience) with concussive traumatic brain injury isn't helpful. I kept thinking it would be more interesting (and aligned to the headline) to look at PTSD sufferers brains when they didn't have a known physical injury to their brains.

Ah, but you seemed to have the point about many of these injuries being non-concussive, in the sense of not causing concussion.

This is an additional mechanism, heretofore unidentified, causing a significantly different injury than concussion.

Re: What If PTSD Is More Physical Than Psychological? Evidence from new study

#30
post #15
post #12

With a background in philosophy and neuroscience, I cringe at articles like this drawing a distinction psychological and physical. They are simply the same thing.

It's still a useful distinction. That's like saying all software is hardware because the bits and bytes are stored in magnetic moments on hard drives etc... Or that biology and chemistry are the same thing because all living things are made of chemicals. Sure, there's some overlap, but the fields are still very distinct. Not to mention that the physiology of the mind isn't very well known. Physicalism of the mind isn…

I agree with the usefulness of it, particularly if the distinction is that psychological problems can be mitigated or cured through learning and dedication, while physical problems cannot, and require drugs or alterations to the body.

The line may be hard to draw, but we are probably better off trying to draw it so that we don't take too many unnecessary drugs or have invasive surgeries when there are other solutions...

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