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Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

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Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#71

Post by paulcole »

forthefuture wrote: post #64
paulcole wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1) Candidates were gaming the admissions process -> we rewrote it. Would love to hear a more thorough explanation of this.

When I took the technical interview ~3 months ago there were very specific questions about functional programming ("implement foreach" kind of questions). Makersquare had the same exact questions, so I assume someone just posted them online and people could easily prepare without understanding.

If that's the case, the lack of follow up questions to identify that kind of faking it is pretty horrifying. Was there nothing like, "explain this technical concept as if you were talking to your grandpa/non-technical person?"

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#73

Post by sixtypoundhound »

Ouch! As a hiring manager, the "Javascript only" model is a serious roadblock.

Nothing against node.js, but a candidate would be marketable to a broader range of shops if the program gave them a basic grounding in Python and SQL. Python is well accepted for both web servers and sysadmin type scripting. SQL is the most common choice for databases. I don't think either one would be a incremental burden and would really open up the number of potential employers for the grads.

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#74

Post by gk1 »

testerofwaters wrote: post #72
gk1 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never said that.

Yes, but you basically implied he deserves "more."

No. Imagine offering a stick of gum to someone whose dog just died. If I suggest that's an inappropriate response, I am not implying they should've offered more gum.

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#75

Post by yompers888 »

mageemooney wrote: post #53

Full disclosure: I am part of the instruction team at Hack Reactor. This amazing team that I work with are completely committed to our students, their experience and their success. I have colleagues who almost don't go home, who work weekends, obsess over how to help our students succeed. We lose sleep. We worry. Truth is, I find the tone of this article dismaying knowing what these remarkable people do for our stude…

>"...the most vindictive account of a student's experience at Hack Reactor ..."

You give yourself so much benefit of the doubt, but offer none to the author, who you've decided is out to get Hack Reactor? That one swipe at the former student is more concerning than the rest of your comment is reassuring, to me.

An alternative reading of the situation, if you're not seeing one: the author has attempted to better herself by one common approach in the programming world, and having a bad experience, she is sending a warning back to others who are seeking the same improvement, telling us, 'this may be the wrong direction.'

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#76

Post by [deleted] »

stevewilhelm wrote: post #47
MattyRad wrote: post #8

$20,000 is about half of what my 4 year college education cost (although it's more expensive now, certainly). That seems incredibly expensive for a bootcamp. I'm obliged to ask what on earth that money is going towards, besides directly into somebody's pockets. > Another observation, most people who get in, are already qualified people, with top university degrees. I'm afraid to ask how large their student loans coul…

UC Davis tuition is currently $14,046 a year.

[deleted]

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#77

Post by yompers888 »

gk1 wrote: post #24
vanessa98 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like you owe the poster more than a beer

Seriously. The author feels as though they've lost $20k and months of their time, and the co-founder thinks the right response is to offer a beer and a chat.

Grandparent is asking for help, not offering repayment in the form of a beer. It's certainly not going to happen if the article's author also sees it as a compensatory transaction. Recognizing that the author has taken some time to consider what may be serious flaws in his program, GP is hoping that the author's desire to pave a better path for others may extend to helping him think about his own program critically.

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#78

Post by hobolord »

ryanSrich wrote: post #11
MattyRad wrote: post #8

$20,000 is about half of what my 4 year college education cost (although it's more expensive now, certainly). That seems incredibly expensive for a bootcamp. I'm obliged to ask what on earth that money is going towards, besides directly into somebody's pockets. > Another observation, most people who get in, are already qualified people, with top university degrees. I'm afraid to ask how large their student loans coul…

When did you graduate? Between 2009 and 2013 my college cost was roughly $40k per year. This was about the average for similar schools (RIT). My wife went to a small liberal arts school during the same time and spent roughly $50k per year. $20k seems like an incredible bargain, but my view is probably warped.

Canadian schools don't charge that much

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#79

Post by seangrogg »

sixtypoundhound wrote: post #73

Ouch! As a hiring manager, the "Javascript only" model is a serious roadblock. Nothing against node.js, but a candidate would be marketable to a broader range of shops if the program gave them a basic grounding in Python and SQL. Python is well accepted for both web servers and sysadmin type scripting. SQL is the most common choice for databases. I don't think either one would be a incremental burden and would really…

Out of curiosity, what kind of scripts can you write in Python that you cannot in Node.js?

Don't get me wrong, Python is great and has a number of really great number crunching libraries just a pip away, but if all you're doing is developing web apps and hashing out some scripts via the terminal... they'll need to know JavaScript for the client - but do they really need to come away with two languages after 3 months?

Re: Confessions of a $20K bootcamp graduate

#80

Post by mageemooney »

yompers888 wrote: post #75
mageemooney wrote: post #53

Full disclosure: I am part of the instruction team at Hack Reactor. This amazing team that I work with are completely committed to our students, their experience and their success. I have colleagues who almost don't go home, who work weekends, obsess over how to help our students succeed. We lose sleep. We worry. Truth is, I find the tone of this article dismaying knowing what these remarkable people do for our stude…

>"...the most vindictive account of a student's experience at Hack Reactor ..." You give yourself so much benefit of the doubt, but offer none to the author, who you've decided is out to get Hack Reactor? That one swipe at the former student is more concerning than the rest of your comment is reassuring, to me. An alternative reading of the situation, if you're not seeing one: the author has attempted to better herse…

I do not represent the school, I speak only for myself and believe it's reasonable for me to express an opinion as someone who believes in and works hard for our school and our students. Further, 1) I am not tone deaf. The author's disdain was thinly veiled and their accounting was full of exaggerations and inaccuracies. This wasn't a simple sharing of how they program works and how it didn't meet their needs. It also raises concerns because I am dismayed that they apparently didn't raise any reasonable concerns they may have had during the program when I and my colleagues were in a position to improve their experience or they would have reported it differently here. Why do you suppose they wouldn't give us that opportunity to make their experience more fruitful given their investment? Constant iteration and openness to feedback is a regular mantra around HR. I wonder (reasonably) if there isn't something else going on here than they report. And 2) I sought to share another perspective. I provided full disclosure about my role in the first sentence, highlighted some specific skewed observations made by the author and encouraged readers to investigate for themselves.

Seems reasonable to me.

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