Bootcamps should be more transparent
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Bootcamps should be more transparent
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Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#2Title is a bit click baity, but I agree with the author's points.
He sees it as a negative thing, but I see it as a massive improvement on college/uni/grad schools, who wouldn't even know where to start with gathering/publishing this data.
Bootcamps are subject to market forces in a way most colleges are not, and it's initiatives like this (what the author is proposing) that give me a sense of optimism for how they'll evolve.
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#3[deleted]
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#4I like how forthcoming you are in your report, and agree that all bootcamps should do the same.
Perhaps we'll see an effect where bootcamps that do high quality reporting will actually be chosen more frequently and thus push other bootcamps to do the same.
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#5Title is a bit click baity, but I agree with the author's points. He sees it as a negative thing, but I see it as a massive improvement on college/uni/grad schools, who wouldn't even know where to start with gathering/publishing this data. Bootcamps are subject to market forces in a way most colleges are not, and it's initiatives like this (what the author is proposing) that give me a sense of optimism for how they'l…
> He sees it as a negative thing, but I see it as a massive improvement on college/uni/grad schools, who wouldn't even know where to start with gathering/publishing this data.
This isn't true in the US. Many schools do actually try to collect this data, but they're typically dealing with far larger populations with far less response rate to surveys, so it isn't as readily available.
Law schools especially report the number of students with jobs, but they're notorious for gaming the system by doing things like hiring their own graduates for a year post graduation and similar nonsense.
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#6In my mind including "tech-adjacent jobs" is a more interesting number. These programs attract a lot of professionals who are trying to add programing to their resume, but not necessarily become full time code monkeys.
A designer who can write html/css/js is more valuable than one who does not. A PM who cannot code is a nightmare to work with. Working with a marketer who can hook up their own jquery plugin is a godsend.
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#7I'm a graduate of an after-hours web development bootcamp who wants to move to a full-time web dev job.
I certainly can't move to a full-time web dev job at a reasonable salary after the bootcamp I attended. If I was willing to intern for 6-12 months at minimum wage, I would be able to - but I could have done that without the bootcamp.
The bootcamp doesn't share stats, only a post-graduation "employment" percentage. Which is pretty meaningless, for example, I'm employed but not doing web dev.
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#8Title is a bit click baity, but I agree with the author's points. He sees it as a negative thing, but I see it as a massive improvement on college/uni/grad schools, who wouldn't even know where to start with gathering/publishing this data. Bootcamps are subject to market forces in a way most colleges are not, and it's initiatives like this (what the author is proposing) that give me a sense of optimism for how they'l…
> He sees it as a negative thing, but I see it as a massive improvement on college/uni/grad schools, who wouldn't even know where to start with gathering/publishing this data. This isn't true in the US. Many schools do actually try to collect this data, but they're typically dealing with far larger populations with far less response rate to surveys, so it isn't as readily available. Law schools especially report the…
True - many schools collect employment data, but unlike the author, they don't tend to shine light on "total costs of program" (like four years of $30-50k/yr salary + housing expenses + books)
Ah, law schools...
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#9I like the idea of transparency from these bootcamps, it'd be a great way to vet them before committing $20k and several months of your time. It makes sense that bootcamps wouldn't be willing to divulge that information though, especially if their numbers aren't great.
But it feels a little unfair to hold the bootcamps completely responsible for people not being able to find jobs. Seems like people have this idea that just showing up is enough. It's not enough to just show up with a piece of paper like 'hey I finished a bootcamp/degree, gimme a job!'
I got my first job out of school with a combination of luck (knowing how to implement conway's game of life) and passion (a side project I had just shipped). Most every job after that has been because of passion. Whether or not you went to school for CS (or at all), or finished a bootcamp is completely irrelevant imho. I probably know more about von neumann architecture, big O and sorting algorithms than my friends without CS degrees... but I've worked with or admired plenty of people who never took a CS class and have mastered lots of things that I haven't. And I can definitely recall a few friends in undergrad who I was sure would go far and never found a single job cuz they sat around waiting for Larry Page to call them personally.
So yeah, tl:dr; school doesn't matter all that much if you're not motivated to continue learning. And if you don't enjoy programming enough to learn && experiment/play you're probably not gonna do well.
Re: Bootcamps should be more transparent
#10[deleted]