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Elite for Emacs

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Re: Elite for Emacs

#41

Post by stcredzero »

jimmcslim wrote: post #8
cstross wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't EVE Online scratch that itch for you?

I'm thinking something that still has a meaningful dogfighting experience (like the original Elite - whereas EVE Online when I last played was more like an RTS?) and generally far more accessible. But a 'casual' and accessible mix of Elite and EVE with a MMO persistent universe and retroish graphics is what I have in mind. Whereas the new Elite: Dangerous as impressive as it looks (and I'd love to play it... just don…

I'm thinking something that still has a meaningful dogfighting experience (like the original Elite - whereas EVE Online when I last played was more like an RTS?) and generally far more accessible.

I am working on an MMO that has a meaningful dogfighting experience. It's not twitch and rapid perfect aiming like an FPS. Instead, it's about relative positioning. Also, it's 2D, using an Asteroids flight mechanic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSlpbxv4zZc&list=PLDIbNZGhS5...

Re: Elite for Emacs

#42

Post by outworlder »

Oh, this is fantastic!

I've toyed with the idea of creating a browser-based version of the original Elite. Went as far as the galaxy generation, based on the C version. Then had trouble, because the algorithm is pretty much obfuscated (unintentionally) behind layers of bit manipulation. And you need to do it the exact same way, otherwise you won't get the iconic galaxy, starting on Lave and with Riedquat as the nearby anarchy.

From a quick glance, the elisp version is slightly more readable in some places. I guess I should try again.

Also, will dig up my Portal Ending recreated in Emacs, as I didn't know there were other crazy brains that found this sort of thing interesting. I wonder if I need to get Valve's permission first.

Re: Elite for Emacs

#43

Post by vityaz_ »

jimmcslim wrote: post #2

I've always wondered if there is scope for a MMO version of Elite that is less ambitious (especially graphically) in some ways than the current Elite: Dangerous but still has the essence of Elite; I'm thinking 3D graphics with a retro vibe, maybe primarily text based menus for in-station activities (and certainly no desire for on-planet or first person shooter components). Even keep the generative universe of the ori…

I've always wanted to play a space mmo with some nice low poly graphics like this for example: http://kennethfejer.deviantart.com/art/lowpoly-spaceship-450...

looks cute

Re: Elite for Emacs

#44

Post by Eded33 »

jimmcslim wrote: post #8
cstross wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't EVE Online scratch that itch for you?

I'm thinking something that still has a meaningful dogfighting experience (like the original Elite - whereas EVE Online when I last played was more like an RTS?) and generally far more accessible. But a 'casual' and accessible mix of Elite and EVE with a MMO persistent universe and retroish graphics is what I have in mind. Whereas the new Elite: Dangerous as impressive as it looks (and I'd love to play it... just don…

I think that was their fatal mistake. The peer-to-peer networking model has made the game feel lifeless and that none of your actions have a persistent effect.

Really wish David B had focused on making a fun solo version of the old game; or a decent online one, not this ... muddle.

Re: Elite for Emacs

#45

Post by technomancy »

DigitalJack wrote: post #32
technomancy wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm working on a spaceflight game that features trading and can be operated from a text interface, though it features graphics by default. My vision is to be a bit more story-based than the procedurally-generated or MMO-type games would be, but it might be what you're looking for: https://technomancy.itch.io/bussard It features programming as one of its core mechanics on top of the piloting features. I made a trailer…

Moving away from clojure? I can't get to the itch.io site from work for some reason, but saw an older version github. What were some of the factors in choosing lua? Has it been weird, difficult, or liberating?

Not as much "moving away from Clojure" as "haven't needed to write any server-side code in a long time". I would still use Clojure for that, unless it was a socket-level cluster thing where BEAM would work better.

Lua is a great fit for this for several reasons. Mainly it's because I want to make it a game where you can learn to program, and teaching beginners Clojure is incredibly difficult. Lua's relentless simplicity really shines here. Teaching tables is a snap, and trying to teach lists, vectors, hashes, and structs in Racket makes my kids' heads swim. Secondly because the of in-game programming, you need sandboxing, and Lua has excellent facilities for this. And Lua's speed and access to the LÖVE game framework make it the best choice for games that I've found.

Lua has its problems, but in the context of games 90% of them can be summed up with "you had a nil where you didn't expect it" which is something Clojure is quite bad at too. I would say in some senses it's been liberating to work on a codebase that doesn't need to interact with the madness of the web, and being able to count my dependencies on one hand (and read through their sources exhaustively) is wonderful.

What were you trying to do on itch.io that didn't work?

Re: Elite for Emacs

#46

Post by DigitalJack »

technomancy wrote: post #45
DigitalJack wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving away from clojure? I can't get to the itch.io site from work for some reason, but saw an older version github. What were some of the factors in choosing lua? Has it been weird, difficult, or liberating?

Not as much "moving away from Clojure" as "haven't needed to write any server-side code in a long time". I would still use Clojure for that, unless it was a socket-level cluster thing where BEAM would work better. Lua is a great fit for this for several reasons. Mainly it's because I want to make it a game where you can learn to program, and teaching beginners Clojure is incredibly difficult. Lua's relentless simplic…

I think it was just a corporate firewall issue. That manifests in odd ways that don't always point clearly to the firewall.

Re: Elite for Emacs

#48

Post by vidarh »

stcredzero wrote: post #40
vidarh wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually don't really like the continuous flight between systems. I prefer the simplicity of Elite. The massive increase in complexity is one of the reasons I never liked the sequels. But don't pay attention to me - I'm unlikely to be representative when it comes to a gamer audience.

I actually don't really like the continuous flight between systems. Are you familiar with Star Control 2's "hyperspace?" It's really not all that more involved than flying into stargates or using the map in Elite, especially for short hops. I wanted to get away from point to point stargates in order to avoid the creation of choke points. I wanted to eliminate "gate camping."

That might be interesting, though I also think that choke points around gates open up interesting game play in itself.

But note that Elite doesn't really need to have choke points around gates, as it doesn't have gates. It has system to system jumps, that leave you "somewhere" far out from the station.

In Elite it doesn't matter whether or not that "somewhere" is in theory the same spot or a random position near the planet, as the system, including any ships, is re-generated from scratch each time you enter.

So in a multiplayer version you could avoid gate camping simply by making it a random position, but as I mentioned I think choke points might be interesting.

Elite has a simple mechanism that is easily extended to prevent such choke points getting out of hand too: Reputation with local law enforcement.

Generally this means you want to do your dirty deeds far away from the stations, but it'd be easy enough to extend it towards the jump points, and make the station security pay attention if there are repeated reports of ambushes.

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