Why I Would Raise Chickens • Hacker News Board

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#31

Post by giarc » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:21 PM UTC

crpatino wrote: post #14

Etarip wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Notice in the video how they're not feeding the chickens by letting them forage. They're always feeding them grain.

Grain in bulk is still cheaper than poultry. However, you have a point. If poor urban families do not have access to fairly priced chicken feed, they will face the choice of feeding them pet food (at a net economic loss) or cutting their losses and eating all the chickens right away.

Please read the article written by Bill. One of the first lines is that chickens are easy to feed because they can make do with stuff they naturally find on the ground. Given grain will help them grow faster, but it's not imperative.

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#32

Post by Grue3 » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:23 PM UTC

CuriouslyC wrote: post #15

spydum wrote: post #10

maybe I'm missing something, what will the chickens eat? "whatever they find on the ground" is not exactly a strategy for growth, especially if everybody is raising chickens, you can pretty much expect the availability of edible stuff to reach zero in villages. not saying this doesnt work, but it's still an energy in/out problem right, where is the new source of energy?

Chickens can eat bugs, plants and food waste that people wouldn't touch. This would work fine assuming at least a temperate climate (ideally tropical) and small villages with a fairly low density.

If chicken can freely walk around, there immediately occurs the problem of people stealing others' chicken. I grew up in a Soviet village and it happened a lot, so I'd imagine it would be even worse in poorer countries.

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#33

Post by giarc » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:25 PM UTC

fiatmoney wrote: post #22

I don't get it. As mentioned in the article, chickens are incredibly easy to bootstrap (ie, it's not like they require a huge capital outlay to get started, and they literally pay dividends in further chickens), and have been present in the area for centuries. What has been the obstacle that has kept them from already being common enough to drive the expected benefit of further investment to ~0? And how is that obsta…

I'm completely speculating, but based on the article it could have something to do with chickens being a "women's animal". Perhaps women aren't confident or allowed to show entrepreneurial spirit to start a flock. The men in the community are saving up for cows and goats.

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#34

Post by BadassFractal » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:25 PM UTC

Any threat that by increasing the # of chickens around humans' living quarters in the third world we might be increasing the chances of developing avian diseases that jump onto surrounding humans, creating new epidemics?

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#35

Post by shostack » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:27 PM UTC

crpatino wrote: post #12

bko wrote: post #3

> If you read this article, watch the video above, and answer one question below, I will donate—on your behalf via Heifer—a flock of chickens to a family in poverty. Giving a flock of chickens to desperately poor families sounds like a great idea that will pay dividends for many years. However, I can't help but be reminded of the many charitable programs that sound great but end up having very unusual unintended cons…

In order of severity: 1. Family ends up homeless because there is no legal framework to raise small anymals in urban environments, and the flock is framed as "unruly pets" by abusive landlord/neighbours. Family ends up worse than how they started without help. 2. Family receives the flock, but not any training/resources to tend them properly. Chickens die of illness, malnourishment, or get killed by urban predators (…

You forgot risk of salmonella and other diseases from not properly handling chicken products (meat, eggs, cleaning up after handling them, etc.), and subsequent lack of medical help because of lack of money and/or lack of insurance.

That said, you have to break some eggs to make an omelette (ok, I guess the pun was intended). These are things you can help educate about in the process and shouldn't stop something like this from being rolled out.

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#36

Post by Benjammer » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:29 PM UTC

crpatino wrote: post #12

bko wrote: post #3

> If you read this article, watch the video above, and answer one question below, I will donate—on your behalf via Heifer—a flock of chickens to a family in poverty. Giving a flock of chickens to desperately poor families sounds like a great idea that will pay dividends for many years. However, I can't help but be reminded of the many charitable programs that sound great but end up having very unusual unintended cons…

In order of severity: 1. Family ends up homeless because there is no legal framework to raise small anymals in urban environments, and the flock is framed as "unruly pets" by abusive landlord/neighbours. Family ends up worse than how they started without help. 2. Family receives the flock, but not any training/resources to tend them properly. Chickens die of illness, malnourishment, or get killed by urban predators (…

Regarding #3, I've heard that one reason cows were made sacred in hinduism is so that people wouldn't slaughter all the dairy cows for meat during times of famine. Not sure how accurate that is though.

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#37

Post by NetStrikeForce » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:30 PM UTC

tonec_ wrote: post #13

bko wrote: post #3

> If you read this article, watch the video above, and answer one question below, I will donate—on your behalf via Heifer—a flock of chickens to a family in poverty. Giving a flock of chickens to desperately poor families sounds like a great idea that will pay dividends for many years. However, I can't help but be reminded of the many charitable programs that sound great but end up having very unusual unintended cons…

I wonder how the local guy or girl selling chickens will take to this idea. This way of 'helping' Africa is so outdated.

Unless they source the chickens locally, from that person selling chicken :)

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#38

Post by hijinks » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:32 PM UTC

clumsysmurf wrote: post #18

If you want to raise backyard chicks, double check your local chicken ordinances! Unfortunately, even when they are allowed, it can be the source of tension between neighbors: http://articles.latimes.com/2012/nov/27/nation/la-na-nn-back...

We have 6 in our backyard and you hardly notice them. They are generally very quiet. The only times ours makes noise is if one chases another.

The birds in the tree make a lot more noise.

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#39

Post by Grishnakh » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:33 PM UTC

spydum wrote: post #10

maybe I'm missing something, what will the chickens eat? "whatever they find on the ground" is not exactly a strategy for growth, especially if everybody is raising chickens, you can pretty much expect the availability of edible stuff to reach zero in villages. not saying this doesnt work, but it's still an energy in/out problem right, where is the new source of energy?

As the other poster said, chickens will eat all kinds of stuff, including food waste. I've even heard you can let them loose in your garden for a limited time and they'll eat all the insects. (However you want to limit their garden time or else they'll eat your crops after finishing off the bugs.)

Re: Why I Would Raise Chickens

#40

Post by newjersey » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 5:35 PM UTC

bryanlarsen wrote: post #16

lumberjack wrote: post #9

It is not specified what they mean by "chicken" (age and breed and sex) but $5 seems like really expensive. I know that you can buy baby chicks from an incubator for egg laying purposes for like 3 euro or less in rural western Europe. Breeds meant to be harvested for their meat cost even less.

I get the impression that's for a fully grown chicken sold for meat. I have no idea how big those chickens are. In North America live chickens sell for between 30 and 50 cents a pound. The chickens in the video look like small roasters, definitely under 10 pounds.

I see decreasing price of chicken/eggs as a good thing. If a fully grown chicken costs upwards of $5, why is it not a good idea to use better facilities? Wouldn't it be cheaper to keep the birds caged up? I guess it depends on our goal here.

Is the idea to give a sense of "ownership" so the program partners feel empowered and can make decisions individually on whether to keep, raise, sell, or eat chicken and eggs?

If it is not that, then I think we should explore industrial farming and some central planning. Five dollars for a small live chicken sounds like a problem which this project can help solve but I think we should welcome bringing down the cost (and keeping it stable at the lower sticker price) of nutrition be it animal-based or plant-based should be welcome.

tl;dr I don't mean to say don't do this but rather we need to do more.