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GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

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Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#161

Post by talnet »

dragontamer wrote: post #110
sbierwagen wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vast majority? Military spending is only 15.75% of the US federal budget. And that's just federal spending, citizens also pay taxes to states and municipalities, which rarely field combat aircraft.

And one of the biggest Military Deployment in the past 10 years was 5,000 troops to Japan to assist in Fukashima. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/11/fukushima-navy-heal... Even if you think that "Fighting ISIS" is destroying civilization (erm... ambiguous. They're destroying civilization. And we are destroying them. I'd say that's a net-gain), there are plenty of good-will projects from the military. Like GPS,…

And OSI and many more.

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#162

Post by forgotpwtomain »

dragontamer wrote: post #110
sbierwagen wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vast majority? Military spending is only 15.75% of the US federal budget. And that's just federal spending, citizens also pay taxes to states and municipalities, which rarely field combat aircraft.

And one of the biggest Military Deployment in the past 10 years was 5,000 troops to Japan to assist in Fukashima. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/11/fukushima-navy-heal... Even if you think that "Fighting ISIS" is destroying civilization (erm... ambiguous. They're destroying civilization. And we are destroying them. I'd say that's a net-gain), there are plenty of good-will projects from the military. Like GPS,…

> Even if you think that "Fighting ISIS" is destroying civilization

"Funding ISIS" (or loosely supplies and training for sectarian groups the US had(s) no control over).

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#163

Post by dang »

etatoby wrote: post #22

If you consider how much money is embezzled / stolen by (most) corporations by avoiding paying taxes for all the services they benefit from, in the countries they operate in, this seems a very good feature.

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11840853 and marked it off-topic.

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#164

Post by dang »

jdimov9 wrote: post #48
etatoby wrote: post #22

If you consider how much money is embezzled / stolen by (most) corporations by avoiding paying taxes for all the services they benefit from, in the countries they operate in, this seems a very good feature.

This must be the most blatantly hypocritical statement I have ever read. Money is STOLEN by corporations by not paying taxes??? How ignorant and thankless can you be? Money is CREATED by these corporations and you owe a huge chunk of your well-being, and quite likely your life, to the existence of said corporations.

This comment breaks the HN guidelines by calling names, being uncivil, and last but not least by using all caps for emphasis. (Just kidding; that is least. But still unwanted.)

Please don't do these things when commenting here. Instead, please (re-)read the guidelines and follow them, by posting civilly and substantively or not at all.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#165

Post by [deleted] »

ultramancool wrote: post #145
ybx wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I don't consider myself a libertarian by any stretch, typically roads and utilities are two of the things that have pretty easy counter-arguments - make utilities free market (or something of the sort) and roads can be paid via tolls. If you want something that doesn't have a good counter-argument, look at policing and contract enforcement (basically, a public legal system). That's something that can't be done…

> Well, unless you don't want the utility at all, you have no choice but to either pay whatever fee they want you to, or move. When you move, it's possible an exclusivity agreement exists there too. One could argue that it's not any better the way it currently is (Comcast, etc.) however you couldn't make it better by making everything privately-owned without regulation, and you could make it better by going further t…

[deleted]

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#166

Post by aninhumer »

X86BSD wrote: post #88
maloney wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So... Your argument is, if the thing taking your money provides you with some benefit it's moral?

I think a better argument is that it's simply not a voluntary contract between two parties. It's theft by one party that has a monopoly on violence to enforce the theft on the other party. Until one day when the other party stops playing by those rules and shoots back. "But you can vote to change it." If voting changed anything it would be illegal. Only an idiot believes "voting" means anything in a two party system…

Property itself is not a voluntary contract between two parties. If you asked a poor person whether they "volunteer" to let a rich person live in a mansion while they live in a trailer, they'd obviously say no. It's only by a threat of violence that the rich person gets to keep that mansion.

Which is not to say that there aren't strong arguments to be made for a system based on property rights, but the idea that they're more "voluntary" than taxation is ridiculous.

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#167

Post by aninhumer »

rglullis wrote: post #154
wstrange wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don't get all the libertarian angst about paying taxes. As a Canadian, I pay a lot of tax. I grumble a bit during tax season - but I am incredibly grateful that I was lucky enough to be born in a prosperous country. A good part of my sucess (education, health care, etc) was paid for by other peoples taxes. So I am quite happy to return the favour. I also want to live in a society that is compassionate and…

(I really shouldn't get into this discussion, as it seems that the HN crowd is down-voting everyone that slightly disagrees with the Big Government and is not into Populist Governments - whether Republican or Democrat. Alas, those are just Internet points and I do think the conversation can be productive.) You live in a developed country that is natural resource-rich, with an established middle class and a somewhat f…

> it seems that the HN crowd is down-voting everyone that slightly disagrees with the Big Government and is not into Populist Governments

HN downvotes libertarians who take the rhetorical position that "tax is theft" (or otherwise inherently immoral), because it's intellectually shallow.

There are many reasonable arguments to be made for reduced taxation, and you have presented many of them above. "Tax is theft" is not one of them.

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#168

Post by aninhumer »

frozenport wrote: post #127
branchless wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By taxing land!!!!!

This will make land ownership harder, which is a regressive measure and will further income inequality. Land and home-ownership represent significant steps towards generational wealth, because when you are paying off a mortgage you own the home while in the case of a lease you own nothing. Literally, this you are advocating economic policy from the Ancien Régime.

It also makes it hard for existing landowners to own land, so they're more inclined to sell it, lowering the prices for everyone.

Also, even if you rent, your landlord is paying the tax, so they'll pass the cost on to you anyway.

Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#169

Post by dang »

X86BSD wrote: post #4

GPL'ed. Dead in the water. But it looks interesting. Good luck guys!

Your comments in this thread repeatedly broke HN's guidelines by being uncivil, unsubstantive, and inflammatory. This kind of flamewar is what we're trying to avoid here. Please don't do it again.

Instead, please (re-)read the following explanations of what HN is looking for, and post civil, substantive comments only from now on.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

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Re: GNU Taler 0.0.0 released

#170

Post by illivah »

shrugger wrote: post #150
kybernetyk wrote: post #13

>Unlike BitCoin or cash payments, Taler ensures that governments can learn their citizen's total income and thus collect sales, value-added or income taxes Wow, what a feature ...

GNU projects are really awesome until people start implementing them.

Yeah, nothing they've ever done was a success...?
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