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Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

computerworld.com

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Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#21

Post by steego »

qxf2 wrote: post #6

I rarely comment but this story makes me happy enough to do so. I'm a former H1-B with an American Masters degree in STEM. I think this conviction will go a long way in making the system fairer. Here is what happened. H1-Bs must be legally employed all (well most of) the time they are in the USA. To get past that rule, these H1-B shops act as employers and then farm out the employees to other companies. Employers nee…

A much better solution would to remove any barriers an H1B worker has to shop for a better job. If we want to live an egalitarian society, it's in our collective interest for immigrants to earn as much as the rest of us. That only happens when we dismantle systems that provide an incentive to exploit immigrants.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#22

Post by revelation »

MrTonyD wrote: post #10

I had a friend at HP - who worked in a group arranging for "tourists" to staff HP projects. It was a "secret" group offsite from HQ and they got lists of major development projects. Then they worked with recruiters worldwide to find staff. They would arrange cars at the airport, long term hotels, and rotated teams in and out of the country to keep the project going. They did this for years and years. We need some rea…

Sounds like the Tesla case:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/may/16/elon-musk...

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#23

Post by pkaye »

_audakel wrote: post #16
qxf2 wrote: post #6

I rarely comment but this story makes me happy enough to do so. I'm a former H1-B with an American Masters degree in STEM. I think this conviction will go a long way in making the system fairer. Here is what happened. H1-Bs must be legally employed all (well most of) the time they are in the USA. To get past that rule, these H1-B shops act as employers and then farm out the employees to other companies. Employers nee…

I think it is yet another point showing how broken our immigration / vIsa program is. This sort of blackmarket style operation would never have existed in the first place if the talanted non US (calling them aliens seems dehumanizing and encourages the us vs them mentality) workers could easily and affordably get permission to work here

This sort of problem could also be resolved by adding whistle blower protection to H1B employees against their employers.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#24

Post by sliverstorm »

qxf2 wrote: post #6

I rarely comment but this story makes me happy enough to do so. I'm a former H1-B with an American Masters degree in STEM. I think this conviction will go a long way in making the system fairer. Here is what happened. H1-Bs must be legally employed all (well most of) the time they are in the USA. To get past that rule, these H1-B shops act as employers and then farm out the employees to other companies. Employers nee…

So this conviction is not that much about H1-B's replacing American workers as much as it is about an unethical employer paying his employees less than the promised wage.

Though, the two are deeply entwined. If you prevent this kind of exploitation, using H1-B's as a source of cheap labor (and thus cheap American worker replacements) becomes less feasible.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#25

Post by sliverstorm »

steego wrote: post #21
qxf2 wrote: post #6

I rarely comment but this story makes me happy enough to do so. I'm a former H1-B with an American Masters degree in STEM. I think this conviction will go a long way in making the system fairer. Here is what happened. H1-Bs must be legally employed all (well most of) the time they are in the USA. To get past that rule, these H1-B shops act as employers and then farm out the employees to other companies. Employers nee…

A much better solution would to remove any barriers an H1B worker has to shop for a better job. If we want to live an egalitarian society, it's in our collective interest for immigrants to earn as much as the rest of us. That only happens when we dismantle systems that provide an incentive to exploit immigrants.

That's no longer an H1-B, that's a totally different program with different goals.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#26

Post by cplanas »

verst wrote: post #7
verst wrote: post #5

This abuse of the H-1B program also hurts the many students attending US universities, hoping to gain work experience here post graduation. Remember that the number of H-1B visas granted every year are capped. Plenty of students from top US universities (and often at the top of their class) cannot accept jobs (or only do so for a very short term under the F-1 OPT program) for which they are the most qualified candida…

This might be interesting to some: The big tech companies in the Bay area may initially hire recent international student graduates on F-1 OPT status and then attempt to apply for their H-1B. If this fails the common approach is to move them to Europe (usually Dublin) to work there for a year. After that time they can return on L-1 (company internal transfer) visas. Note that these candidates are extremely competitiv…

I know someone in a similar, but slightly different situation. He worked for a European-based SaaS company; an American competitor offered him a job in the Bay. When he didn't win the lottery, they had him working in Dublin for a year, and now he is in SF on a L1.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#27

Post by verst »

cplanas wrote: post #26
verst wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This might be interesting to some: The big tech companies in the Bay area may initially hire recent international student graduates on F-1 OPT status and then attempt to apply for their H-1B. If this fails the common approach is to move them to Europe (usually Dublin) to work there for a year. After that time they can return on L-1 (company internal transfer) visas. Note that these candidates are extremely competitiv…

I know someone in a similar, but slightly different situation. He worked for a European-based SaaS company; an American competitor offered him a job in the Bay. When he didn't win the lottery, they had him working in Dublin for a year, and now he is in SF on a L1.

Right. That's a common route for those who didn't attend a US university and didn't win the lottery.

If you went to a US university, you would have started working on your F1 OPT. You now have 3 years to win the lottery.

If that were to fail (EDIT: you are an essential employee and you happen to work for one of the large tech companies) you'd likely be moved to a foreign office of that company for a year, then transferred back in on a L-1 visa.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#29

Post by rhizome »

steego wrote: post #21
qxf2 wrote: post #6

I rarely comment but this story makes me happy enough to do so. I'm a former H1-B with an American Masters degree in STEM. I think this conviction will go a long way in making the system fairer. Here is what happened. H1-Bs must be legally employed all (well most of) the time they are in the USA. To get past that rule, these H1-B shops act as employers and then farm out the employees to other companies. Employers nee…

A much better solution would to remove any barriers an H1B worker has to shop for a better job. If we want to live an egalitarian society, it's in our collective interest for immigrants to earn as much as the rest of us. That only happens when we dismantle systems that provide an incentive to exploit immigrants.

You're describing the entire framework of immigration, from green cards to citizenship, which already exists. You can say the H1B component should be removed, but business leaders will cry bloody murder if a whiff of that legislation ever crosses the transom.

Re: Judge sends two to prison for 7 years for H-1B fraud

#30

Post by bogomipz »

verst wrote: post #20
selectron wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The don't replace anyone statement doesn't make any sense. Instead of training foreign workers we could be training American workers for these jobs.

Are you suggesting that companies should not be able to hire the most qualified individuals who went through the same system as everybody else? [EDIT (rephrasing): There is no particular training provided. The international students received the same education as US students at US institutions.] International students generally have to pay for everything out of pocket (they are not eligible for any public/tax-payer b…

Are you seriously saying that foreign students subsidize the education of US citizens? That is one of the most absurd statements I've ever read on HN. US student's educations are paid for by student loans, they fund their own tuitions I can assure you.

Attending university in the US is a privilege and that does not mean you should be guaranteed a job in the United States upon graduation. You seem to have a real sense of entitlement that because you went to school in the US the US owes you a job. Wow.

This idea that the most talented people can only be found from outside the US needs to just die. If the US were so bereft of talent none of these companies that these H1B visa folks want to work for would exist. Ditto for the US universities they attend.

This idea of relocating people to London for year is just gaming the system.

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