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Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

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Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#111

Post by seanmcdirmid »

khedoros wrote: post #78
Rumudiez wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I would still need a car for commuting to work. And that sums up why the typical US mentality will continue to impede transportation progress. I can easily carry over a week's worth of groceries to cook three meals per day for two people in one trip on my motorcycle. I ride to work every day of the year in Seattle . It's kind of like, you know, living in pretty much any other country in the world where cars are…

It's a chicken+egg problem. I've considered riding a bicycle to work (it's only about 6 miles), but there are busy streets without bicycle lanes (or even sidewalks), and drivers in the area are known to be actively aggressive against cyclists. These things drive down the numbers of cyclists, which increases the general feeling that they aren't accepted, and that it's not worth it to cater to them. > if we could just…

Meh. The streets of Beijing are even busier, the motorist even more aggressive, most of the bike lanes have become parking for cars, and it still seems to work.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#112

Post by walrus01 »

rakoo wrote: post #77
URSpider94 wrote: post #16

The e-bike situation in China is very different from the US. These are people who are moving UP from human-powered bikes, or walking, to their first vehicle -- not buying them so that they can leave their car at home and feel the wind in their hair. Here's a photo of a very typical Chinese e-bike: http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00zsrEyYQIYOqo/Chinese-El... As you can see, it has a second seat in the back for a pa…

Another huge reason is that China outright banned the use of gasoline powered motorcycles in many big cities; since the majority of people just can't afford a car, the only replacement they could have is electric bikes. Maybe one day we'll also see gasoline powered personal vehicles be banned in the West ? I kind of doubt it, seeing how important the car is in our society, even though there is some progress towards i…

> Another huge reason is that China outright banned the use of gasoline powered motorcycles in many big cities; since the majority of people just can't afford a car, the only replacement they could have is electric bikes.

Imagine how polluted the air in major Chinese cities would be if they didn't do this. For a counter example visit Karachi or Lahore and observe the air, both huge population centres that are full of small 2-stroke engined motorcycles and motor-rickshaws emitting blue grey exhaust everywhere.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#113

Post by Retric »

Gibbon1 wrote: post #105
DigitalJack wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really like to hear the rationale for downvotes, just because it's surprising to me.

People downvote stuff when they dislike the implications of something even if it's true, actually especially if it's true. As to your point, a friend of mine has an electric motorcycle. He said that it's silent is scary because in traffic cars don't notice he's there. He has to always be on guard for people merging into his lane.

Adding a speaker would not take a lot of power.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#114

Post by beambot »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #110
URSpider94 wrote: post #16

The e-bike situation in China is very different from the US. These are people who are moving UP from human-powered bikes, or walking, to their first vehicle -- not buying them so that they can leave their car at home and feel the wind in their hair. Here's a photo of a very typical Chinese e-bike: http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00zsrEyYQIYOqo/Chinese-El... As you can see, it has a second seat in the back for a pa…

> I'm curious how people charge and store these vehicles, since most people in Chinese cities live in multi-story dwellings -- I guess they must lug the batteries upstairs with them at night? Yep, you carry the battery up to your apartment each night, or just take your bike up. I really wonder how people with those Tesla Model S's I'm seeing all around manage, since parking is so difficult and its usually on the stre…

Are you in SFBA? If so, many tech companies have free (or subsidized) charging stations on their corporate campuses -- so people are recharging at work rather than at home.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#115

Post by contingencies »

URSpider94 wrote: post #16

The e-bike situation in China is very different from the US. These are people who are moving UP from human-powered bikes, or walking, to their first vehicle -- not buying them so that they can leave their car at home and feel the wind in their hair. Here's a photo of a very typical Chinese e-bike: http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00zsrEyYQIYOqo/Chinese-El... As you can see, it has a second seat in the back for a pa…

That's not a particularly common design. The common designs are heavier looking, eg: http://119.10.46.20:9999/images/T1uxEvBXDT1RXrhCrK.jpg ... the lighter designs have less batteries and haul a lot less.

Note the metal bar around the weak plastic housing, this protects it against falls and accidents. Notice also the fold-out passenger foot-rests. The seat opens to reveal covered storage space: many people use this to keep rain-covers of various types. Inside will be typically five to seven batteries, which last about a year with reasonably heavy daily use. Replacement is about USD$90-150.

I'm curious how people charge and store these vehicles

Most apartment/office blocks or shopping/entertainment areas have someone who 'minds' the vehicles against theft. They also provide power plugs for charging your batteries. At least around here, the fee for such a service is about 1-2元 per day (USD$0.15-0.30). Power is cheap in China... we have vast numbers of hydro-electric dams here in the south-west, and probably state subsidy.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#116

Post by Retric »

jessaustin wrote: post #80
Spooky23 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless marked as a multi-use path, it's a sidewalk.

Well sure I assumed that it's actually a sidewalk, but there's no reason to be authoritarian. If there really aren't any pedestrians around then cyclists really aren't harming anyone. If one is cycling on the sidewalk and sees a pedestrian, one simply hops off the bike and walks it until the pedestrian is out of range.

Sidewalks are a lot more dangerous for bikes than you might think. The problem is cars have expectations on how fast people approach and will often assume an area is clear based on walking speed. Further even low speed collisions with pedestrians can easily send a rider into traffic.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#117

Post by analog31 »

I'm a year-round bike commuter in the upper Midwest. I also use my bike(s) for errands, recreation, etc., though I own a car for longer trips.

These days I'm seeing a growing number of e-bikes on paths that were designed as bike infrastructure but are multi-use. My view is that they'll be OK so long as the behavior of the riders doesn't get out of hand, which we'll find out when the accident statistics start to pile up in bigger cities. For now they're relatively few in number, and the riders tend to be quite courteous.

I'm supportive if it increases demand for bike infrastructure and awareness of bike safety.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#118

Post by seanmcdirmid »

beambot wrote: post #114
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm curious how people charge and store these vehicles, since most people in Chinese cities live in multi-story dwellings -- I guess they must lug the batteries upstairs with them at night? Yep, you carry the battery up to your apartment each night, or just take your bike up. I really wonder how people with those Tesla Model S's I'm seeing all around manage, since parking is so difficult and its usually on the stre…

Are you in SFBA? If so, many tech companies have free (or subsidized) charging stations on their corporate campuses -- so people are recharging at work rather than at home.

I work for Microsoft in Beijing, we are pushing for charging pylons in our garage now; we just did a renovation and completely forgot that!

They should really figure out home charging also, however. The problem is that most people don't buy parking spots in their apartment garages, and even if they did the garages don't have pylons and there isn't much will to put them in. Having to drive to work to charge is a bit of an issue on the weekend! But I guess the people that own Model S's are rich since they are around $120K here, maybe they all have villas in Shunyi or other places in the suburbs.

Re: Electric Bikes Won Over China. Is the U.S. Next?

#120

Post by ropiku »

Brakenshire wrote: post #98
khedoros wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a chicken+egg problem. I've considered riding a bicycle to work (it's only about 6 miles), but there are busy streets without bicycle lanes (or even sidewalks), and drivers in the area are known to be actively aggressive against cyclists. These things drive down the numbers of cyclists, which increases the general feeling that they aren't accepted, and that it's not worth it to cater to them. > if we could just…

I suspect a lot of it is pure population density. The US needs to make downtown areas pedestrian and bike friendly, and then allow high density development near the centre. That makes the bike lanes and the bus network self supporting. In London there was a very big push to extend the bus network about 15 years ago, by the left-wing mayor (who had been given newly created powers). He also introduced a congestion char…

Also the intentional lack of parking. Even if I would get a car I wouldn't have where to park it (or it would be very expensive). The US mandates parking which prevents high density benefits and increases building costs.
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