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Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

nytimes.com

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Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#181

Post by eli_gottlieb »

blowski wrote: post #18

And I guess the converse question which has vexed socialists for decades - why do so many of the poor vote for centre-right, business-friendly parties? For example, why did so many working class people vote for Thatcher in UK in the 1980s? Why are they not massively in favour of Jeremy Corbyn right now? I'm not saying it's irrational. But sometimes it's odd to hear people who need the government to subsidise their mi…

>And I guess the converse question which has vexed socialists for decades - why do so many of the poor vote for centre-right, business-friendly parties? For example, why did so many working class people vote for Thatcher in UK in the 1980s? Why are they not massively in favour of Jeremy Corbyn right now?

I think the more appropriate question is: how many working-class people voted for Thatcher, as a percentage? How many favor Corbyn today? Which number is larger?

There has always been false consciousness, but I think it's often overstated the degree to which the working class actively holds and participates in false consciousness, rather than simply being repressed or ignored.

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#182

Post by panglott »

fab13n wrote: post #72

I'm an upper-middle class, over-educated professional expert, and I'm strongly liberal for selfish reasons: mostly, I want to live in a climate of social peace, and would prefer to be surrounded by people who foster a mood of solidarity and benevolence, rather than a cut-throat and ever-worsening competitive mindset. So sure, one way is to protect myself and those I love behind a gated community. But that's pretty mu…

People who are willing to endure being a grad student in order to become a professor are probably relatively less motivated by monetary incentives.

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#183

Post by eli_gottlieb »

harrumph wrote: post #170
throwaway7312 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re assuming poor American working class voters vote against their interests by voting conservative. Leaving aside the social issues for now and looking solely at economic ones, let’s ask the question whether that’s true to them in their own minds. The American liberal party (Democrats) brands itself as the party that’s going to help you out. It’ll leverage redistribution (taxes) to take money from rich people and…

"[The Democrats] get you stuff like free healthcare, free college, unemployment insurance, etc." No offense, but there's something basic that is amiss with a formulation when two thirds of the examples given are political results that have never been delivered by Democrats and the last one, unemployment insurance, was only grudgingly produced under conditions of a) depression b) significant pressure from the socialis…

Indeed. Democrats/liberals are the class party of white-collar professionals and self-styled "meritocrats". Democrat vs Republican should be read as new money vs old money.

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#184

Post by abritinthebay »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #160
fab13n wrote: post #72

I'm an upper-middle class, over-educated professional expert, and I'm strongly liberal for selfish reasons: mostly, I want to live in a climate of social peace, and would prefer to be surrounded by people who foster a mood of solidarity and benevolence, rather than a cut-throat and ever-worsening competitive mindset. So sure, one way is to protect myself and those I love behind a gated community. But that's pretty mu…

You actually sound more like a social-democrat than a liberal. Liberals do not refer to property as a mere social construct.

To be fair though, and this is a common mistake, there is a world of difference between "Someone who holds general liberal positions" and "Someone who specifically subscribes to the policies of Classical Liberalism."

What you are referring to is Classical Liberalism which is a very specific thing.

What most people mean by "Liberal" is ideas of liberty and equality. Which is the generic form of Liberalism. (There are many sub-categories, including Classical, Conservative, Social, and Economic Liberalism)

Under those terms property would be a social construct (and contract).

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#185

Post by [deleted] »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #160
fab13n wrote: post #72

I'm an upper-middle class, over-educated professional expert, and I'm strongly liberal for selfish reasons: mostly, I want to live in a climate of social peace, and would prefer to be surrounded by people who foster a mood of solidarity and benevolence, rather than a cut-throat and ever-worsening competitive mindset. So sure, one way is to protect myself and those I love behind a gated community. But that's pretty mu…

You actually sound more like a social-democrat than a liberal. Liberals do not refer to property as a mere social construct.

[deleted]

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#186

Post by jamesblonde »

Kurtz79 wrote: post #120
fab13n wrote: post #72

I'm an upper-middle class, over-educated professional expert, and I'm strongly liberal for selfish reasons: mostly, I want to live in a climate of social peace, and would prefer to be surrounded by people who foster a mood of solidarity and benevolence, rather than a cut-throat and ever-worsening competitive mindset. So sure, one way is to protect myself and those I love behind a gated community. But that's pretty mu…

"I'm an upper-middle class, over-educated professional expert, and I'm strongly liberal for selfish reasons: mostly, I want to live in a climate of social peace, and would prefer to be surrounded by people who foster a mood of solidarity and benevolence, rather than a cut-throat and ever-worsening competitive mindset." That's mostly my rationale for being in favor of (moderate) wealth redistribution, which on surface…

Here in Sweden the left wing fight to prevent universal social entitlements, but right wingers want them means tested. That's coherent with tho line of reasoning

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#187

Post by gozur88 »

patrickg_zill wrote: post #179

It never seems to occur to anyone that maybe, just maybe ... there is an anti-conservative selection pressure or bias? Look at the "nomenklatura" in USSR times - they were all good Party members, and they too, had the higher university degrees. If you weren't a Party member or in other ways, indicated disloyalty to the prevailing political worldview ... you didn't get admitted to the choice spots. How many "Western-s…

This. It boils down to tenure. An open conservative is not going to get tenure outside the hard sciences, so there's not much reason to get a PhD.

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#188

Post by [deleted] »

gallonofmilk wrote: post #19
Fej wrote: post #4

The two parties have been getting more polarized, that much is clear. The problem with the GOP from an educated person's perspective is that many, if not most of its politicians get elected through anti-intellectual rhetoric. Trump is the most extreme example of this. He makes no actual arguments and just attacks his detractors. An educated group taught to embrace science will certainly take issue with leaders who ig…

> GOP is the party of creationists and climate deniers... how is this statement different than e.g. "the democratic party is the party of socialists and communists"? they're both bold assertions on a large group of people that are unlikely to be true for the majority... to be honest it just sounds smug

[deleted]

Re: Why Are the Highly Educated So Liberal?

#189

Post by internaut »

perilous333 wrote: post #5

There is a curious (albeit incomplete) parallel here to Moldbug's theory of the five castes of the United States.

Funny you should mention He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named, because in this very thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11829796

I love watching Mr Bug's thought percolate through the Net. I can only imagine this is what it must have been like for the first proto-Communists as Karl Marx went to town.

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