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Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

magenta.tensorflow.org

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Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#41

Post by Razengan »

wslh wrote: post #39

Now I see the scifi story: a disruptive future where culture is created by computers so Google doesn't need to pay any creator in YouTube.

AI celebrities with distinctive personalities will be fun. I can't wait to see a real-life (as it were) Hatsune Miku making her own content.

EDIT: And then the inevitable schism among fans about what their base personalities should have been like, and the resulting clones, throwing the AIs into an existential crisis when confronted with their alternative versions..

Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#44

Post by julianpye »

aclissold wrote: post #22
julianpye wrote: post #16

Keyboards have been popping out automatic C-maj, A-min, F-maj, G-maj progressions for fourty years now. And with the typical toolset for electronic music, it will be easily capable to create something similar. But the masterpieces of music demand something altogether different. Beethoven's break with consistency by switching keys in the adagio of the 5th piano concerto. Wagner introducing the Tristan chord, Berg usin…

Regarding Kindertotenlieder, he didn't actually lose any children until after he wrote it. Quoth Wikipedia [0]: “I placed myself in the situation that a child of mine had died. When I really lost my daughter, I could not have written these songs any more.” [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kindertotenlieder

Thanks. Turns out I was taught me something completely wrong about Mahler! I just spoke to my parents (who were responsible for much of my musical education) and told them this, too. It seems they knew it from their parents, too.

Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#45

Post by cdubzzz »

vintermann wrote: post #32
tunesmith wrote: post #10

There's music and then there's music. I'm glad they are at least thinking about long narrative structures. Ultimately I don't think this is a very worthwhile because I personally believe the entire definition of art and music is a production that is filtered through the human experience. The same piece of music would mean more to me coming from a human than from an AI or program. If someone told me it was from a huma…

Well, look at it this way: The AI is really not so different from us in intelligence (although presently dumber), but it's different in motivation. It's has only one single "desire", namely to understand you and write music that connects with you. It's not trying to fool you, it's trying to understand the human experience itself, and tell back to you what it is seeing. Isn't it OK to let ourselves be moved by its lov…

That's an interesting thought. I have no idea how complicated this is, but I wonder if a Spotify or Pandora has a chance to some day develop something that can _generate_ music tuned specifically to the listening habits of individual users.

Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#46

Post by smashthesystems »

ElHacker wrote: post #7
my_username_is_ wrote: post #3

Having recently spent some time browsing the submissions of /r/deepdream and seeing how far computer generated imaging has come, I have no doubts that one day we will be listening to wonderful sounds that are generated by artificial intelligence. However an intrinsic part of the music (to me, anyways) as an art form, is the humanity of it. A computer can generate lyrics that are relatable on the surface, but knowing…

> but knowing that there isn't a person behind those words, feeling what I'm feeling, definitely detracts from the experience of the whole. It would be very interesting to create a secret fake person profile and publish AI generated music under that fake name and see if humans feel identified with the lyrics and music. See how far it goes, who knows, maybe create the next super star. Then to later reveal the secret.

The 'Tunein' test

Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#47

Post by Ntrails »

thomasahle wrote: post #37
my_username_is_ wrote: post #3

Having recently spent some time browsing the submissions of /r/deepdream and seeing how far computer generated imaging has come, I have no doubts that one day we will be listening to wonderful sounds that are generated by artificial intelligence. However an intrinsic part of the music (to me, anyways) as an art form, is the humanity of it. A computer can generate lyrics that are relatable on the surface, but knowing…

> but knowing that there isn't a person behind those words, feeling what I'm feeling, definitely detracts from the experience of the whole. I recently had a discussion about this with a musician. I said that I didn't like when music was produced (and certainly lyrics written by) somebody else than the performer. I said it took away from the experience of 'getting to know' the person I was listening to. She basically…

I only really care whether the singer is able to convey the emotion behind the song. In reality I don't even know who writes a given song most of the time, only the performer.

We can argue whether, for example, Adele is better at conveying emotion because she wrote the song. What we shouldn't do is claim that it's impossible for someone to do so if they didn't write the lyrics themselves.

Now, once you abstract that, does it matter whether the original writer was human as long as they produce something a singer can then connect with emotionally and then project? I don't know. I feel like ignorance would be bliss.

Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#48

Post by nkozyra »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #38
alive2007 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this sort of application having a lot of use in the kinds of derivative pop music developed by ensembles of songwriters and manufactured purely to generate radio hits. Bacon's Triptych of George Dyer is genius. The average person listening to Taylor Swift just does not care about Bacon's Triptych of George Dyer. In a way, Magenta's job is not besting Bach. By the definition of Bach (a human being who changes th…

The average person listening to Taylor Swift is thinking about Taylor Swift, and not what they're listening to. Pop is maybe 75% performance, sex, status, and charisma. The music isn't irrelevant, but it only really needs to be a committee-produced mashup of contemporary cliches to do its job. The rest is posing and attitude. >As it turns out, this kind of music is already pretty formulaic. But it's less formulaic th…

> The average person listening to Taylor Swift is thinking about Taylor Swift, and not what they're listening to.

I think this is a grand oversimplification. Personality certainly _contributes_ to pop stardom, but the music is still #1. Before anyone knew who Taylor Swift was, they connected with her through one or more song.

> A lot of creative detail goes into the production, arrangement, and the vocal performance. Not the MIDI file.

Of course, but even having an autonomous "songwriter" that could write _a_ hit would be a gamechanger for music (though obviously most immediately applicable to top 40 / pop)

> You need a model of mind to do that last one

I disagree. Machines already produce what would otherwise be considered "experimental" music, you just need some deep reinforcement learning to know what has mass appeal.

Re: Welcome to Magenta – Google music AI project

#50

Post by maroonblazer »

6stringmerc wrote: post #49

Strange, the article doesn't link to the output: https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/6577761/G... I had a listen yesterday. It's okay. Nothing revolutionary. Competent though.

Sounds like something you'd hear as a soundtrack to an ad for a computing device.
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