Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

theatlantic.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 93 posts

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#21

Post by vitobcn »

ardit33 wrote: post #3

It might sound awful, but this is one of the reasons I avoid dating 28+ girls (I am 29 myself). 1. Too much pressure. (even if it is not explicit, given her standing, it is implicit) 2. I don't know if she likes me for me, or just because her clock is ticking. On the flip side, girls it have really really easy on their early 20s. That might create an "suply is infinite" kind of thinking in girls, and maybe perhaps ev…

I don't think your comment sounds awful, but in my opinion you are giving too much importance to age and looks.

I am 28 myself and when dating I am not trying to evaluate whether she already passed her prime time or if she still has a couple of good years cause she is Asian. Unless you are a teenager or in the early twenties, we are all going downhill. Shouldn't we try to find a partner who we like and share interests with, regardless of age (obviously, there are some boundaries).

It seems you don't want a girl to 'settle' with you, but there's a ton of reasons to do so independently of her age. Maybe she wants you only for your money, or your looks...

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#22

Post by Xichekolas »

rglullis wrote: post #16
andreyf wrote: post #6

Lori Gottlieb, in The Atlantic, writes "Marry Him!", and describes a problem so pervasive and urgent it's hard to imagine Obama hasn't cleared his desk: what's an "independent," "feminist," "heterosexual" 40-something "woman" with a sperm-donor child to do when she can't find a man to marry her? I found this analysis of the author much more interesting than the original article: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/02…

This is just an analysis of the author, in no point it addresses the issue that she mentions. The "psych" just calls her ideas "dangerous" in the end, and sticks to an ad-hominem. I'd like to read someone who can actually find a counter-argument to her thesis and convince me that the best thing women can do is to hold on to their ideal all the way to the end.

I'm not sure that counterargument could really be made. Anyone holding out for an ideal person is going to be looking forever. Everyone has faults. The relationship depends on whether you can still be happy despite those faults.

That said, I think Lori is totally misguided. She feels she hasn't found a guy because her standards were too high, and that now she needs to lower them and "settle". Maybe she hasn't found a guy because she was too busy measuring guys by some predefined standards, and missed out on having fun. At the end of the day, standards and faults don't really matter if you enjoy being with the other person.

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#23

Post by kpanghmc »

nfnaaron wrote: post #7
Tichy wrote: post #4

Couldn't there be a third way: make demands less strict in society? I remember reading that women in Iceland are among the happiest on the planet, because they are not under so much strain to sustain a relationship forever. It is not frowned upon to break up. Women just move back with families and date again. Since > 50% of marriages seem to break anyway (if I remember correctly), maybe it would be better to approach…

Someone in the marriage breakup industry told me that 75% of all second marriages fail. I think we should have five and ten year civil contracts, with options to renew. What you do religiously is your own business.

That wouldn't work so great for men / women who elect to become househusbands / housewives upon marriage. While the other partner spends those 10 years building their career, they toil away at home cleaning, preparing meals, and raising the kids, only to be left high and dry when their partner declines to renew. Now what are they to do? They have little job experience to build upon.

Unless your solution comes with alimony / child support, I don't see how it would work. And if it did, what's so different about it than getting a divorce?

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#24

Post by gambling8nt »

nfnaaron wrote: post #7
Tichy wrote: post #4

Couldn't there be a third way: make demands less strict in society? I remember reading that women in Iceland are among the happiest on the planet, because they are not under so much strain to sustain a relationship forever. It is not frowned upon to break up. Women just move back with families and date again. Since > 50% of marriages seem to break anyway (if I remember correctly), maybe it would be better to approach…

Someone in the marriage breakup industry told me that 75% of all second marriages fail. I think we should have five and ten year civil contracts, with options to renew. What you do religiously is your own business.

About 30% of first marriages and 40% of second marriages fail within the first ten years (and, as the parent noted over 50% of first marriages fail-- see table 41 and the appendix table II of http://cdc.gov/nchs/data/series/sr_23/sr23_022.pdf ). About 20% of each fail within the first five years.

Ten years is not enough time for children to be conceived and raised to maturity in a two-parent home (a situation that significantly improves probable education and life outcomes for a child). Ten-year term contracts are too short to secure the primary purpose of marriage--forming families to raise children--and too long to make a large dent on the divorce rate.

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#25

Post by kpanghmc »

vitobcn wrote: post #21
ardit33 wrote: post #3

It might sound awful, but this is one of the reasons I avoid dating 28+ girls (I am 29 myself). 1. Too much pressure. (even if it is not explicit, given her standing, it is implicit) 2. I don't know if she likes me for me, or just because her clock is ticking. On the flip side, girls it have really really easy on their early 20s. That might create an "suply is infinite" kind of thinking in girls, and maybe perhaps ev…

I don't think your comment sounds awful, but in my opinion you are giving too much importance to age and looks. I am 28 myself and when dating I am not trying to evaluate whether she already passed her prime time or if she still has a couple of good years cause she is Asian. Unless you are a teenager or in the early twenties, we are all going downhill. Shouldn't we try to find a partner who we like and share interest…

I think the OP's main point was that when you date a woman in her 30s, there's a lot of pressure to get married and have babies ASAP. Because while it's certainly possible for a woman to become pregnant in their 30s, the chances pretty much go into a freefall during that decade. So even though as a man, you stand a higher chance with women in that age range, you'll always have this lingering doubt of whether she's with you because she wants you or if she's with you because she's running out of time.

You're right though that there are plenty of other reasons a woman could be interested in you, but I think you might be underestimating just how loud that biological clock is ticking in a woman's brain when she hits 30.

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#26

Post by kingkawn »

ardit33 wrote: post #3

It might sound awful, but this is one of the reasons I avoid dating 28+ girls (I am 29 myself). 1. Too much pressure. (even if it is not explicit, given her standing, it is implicit) 2. I don't know if she likes me for me, or just because her clock is ticking. On the flip side, girls it have really really easy on their early 20s. That might create an "suply is infinite" kind of thinking in girls, and maybe perhaps ev…

The desire to systematize every aspect of life is why you're still just dating.

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#27

Post by indiejade »

vitobcn wrote: post #21
ardit33 wrote: post #3

It might sound awful, but this is one of the reasons I avoid dating 28+ girls (I am 29 myself). 1. Too much pressure. (even if it is not explicit, given her standing, it is implicit) 2. I don't know if she likes me for me, or just because her clock is ticking. On the flip side, girls it have really really easy on their early 20s. That might create an "suply is infinite" kind of thinking in girls, and maybe perhaps ev…

I don't think your comment sounds awful, but in my opinion you are giving too much importance to age and looks. I am 28 myself and when dating I am not trying to evaluate whether she already passed her prime time or if she still has a couple of good years cause she is Asian. Unless you are a teenager or in the early twenties, we are all going downhill. Shouldn't we try to find a partner who we like and share interest…

Perspective changes as you get older. Besides, women live longer than men, and reach their prime later. There are a lot of reasons it makes sense for a female to date a male who is slightly younger than him.

So. . . I daresay that the comment does sound pretty awful. Awful is probably the wrong word. Delusional, megalomaniac, may be better words. Anybody who doesn't have a bell curve around the ages of people they're willing to date (yes, with his/her own age in the middle) is probably missing a few logic gates.

Given the gendercide and such, it's pretty certain that the world will never have shortage of creepy old men.

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#28

Post by derefr »

codexon wrote: post #18
pvg wrote: post #10

The Cosmo-ification of HN continues apace. Next week, esr's sex tips FAQ. I know someone will very earnestly explain to me how this is on topic but really, it isn't.

I personally don't find these types of articles interesting either, but the HN guidelines say this: On-Topic: Anything that good hackers would find interesting. That includes more than hacking and startups. So if this story has upvotes, I presume some "good hackers" here have found it interesting.

You presume wrongly. Communities begin with a "primary demographic"—people who are there for what it says on the tin. Over time, though, these communities start to lure in "secondary demographics" that are interested in both the community topic and other topics, but then those people in turn lure in "tertiary demographics," who aren't interested in the stated purpose of the community at all, only about the hybrid on-/off-topic stuff the secondary demographic posts. The tertiary demographic then posts stories like this one, which the secondary demographic upvotes, and the primary tolerates because they value the participation of the secondary demographic. Before you know it, the tertiary utterly dominates the community, and there is no more topic to be "on topic" about (especially in communities where "on topic" is small and static, but the community allows growth despite this.)

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#29

Post by rglullis »

Xichekolas wrote: post #22
rglullis wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just an analysis of the author, in no point it addresses the issue that she mentions. The "psych" just calls her ideas "dangerous" in the end, and sticks to an ad-hominem. I'd like to read someone who can actually find a counter-argument to her thesis and convince me that the best thing women can do is to hold on to their ideal all the way to the end.

I'm not sure that counterargument could really be made. Anyone holding out for an ideal person is going to be looking forever. Everyone has faults. The relationship depends on whether you can still be happy despite those faults. That said, I think Lori is totally misguided. She feels she hasn't found a guy because her standards were too high, and that now she needs to lower them and "settle". Maybe she hasn't found a…

I completely agree with you. Thing is, I also think that Lori is not the exception, but may be very well part of the larger group. In that light, the article is something much more important and interesting.

Re: Marry Him: The case for settling for Mr. Good Enough

#30

Post by slig »

kingkawn wrote: post #26
ardit33 wrote: post #3

It might sound awful, but this is one of the reasons I avoid dating 28+ girls (I am 29 myself). 1. Too much pressure. (even if it is not explicit, given her standing, it is implicit) 2. I don't know if she likes me for me, or just because her clock is ticking. On the flip side, girls it have really really easy on their early 20s. That might create an "suply is infinite" kind of thinking in girls, and maybe perhaps ev…

The desire to systematize every aspect of life is why you're still just dating.

This made me think in a way I never thought before. Thanks.
Post reply on HN