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Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

nautil.us

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Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#11

Post by distances »

simonbarker87 wrote: post #7
eva1984 wrote: post #3

Why US is different from all the other countries in the charts? If author's hypothesis is right, that it is mainly about declining of economic status, I cannot see why other western countries would not follow a similar pattern. And from the chart, US's (whites) death rates takes off starting from late 90s, where the economy was doing great, while other countries' death rates keep declining even during great recession…

An article on HN last week discussed the idea of a class of people called the Unnecessariat ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11765581 ) where a large swatch of people no longer have a place in society thanks to declining manufacturing jobs (and potentially the automation of farming) in the middle of America and as such these people have been left to die by the state as they are surplus to requirements in the mo…

The Unnecessariat also linked to a Washington Post article (http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/national/2016/04/08/we-dont...) describing the life and death of one of those who died too young, in rural Oklahoma. A good read, while of course so very sad that we can't see a solution to this phenomenon.

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#12

Post by minikites »

baron816 wrote: post #4

All these problems (as the author mentions) are closely related to lower rates of social connectedness. This is obviously a huge problem, probably the biggest problem in the advanced world, yet it seems to be mostly ignored. My company, Krewe ( https://www.gokrewe.com ), is addressing it by trying to make it really easy for people to make a new group of friends in their neighborhood and become connected with their lo…

I know a popular meme in SV/tech culture is that apps can solve everything but this is a much harder problem than that, requiring a societal and possibly government response. I don't think you can even begin to address it at the scale of one startup, at best you can skim some money off the top.

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#14

Post by madengr »

eva1984 wrote: post #3

Why US is different from all the other countries in the charts? If author's hypothesis is right, that it is mainly about declining of economic status, I cannot see why other western countries would not follow a similar pattern. And from the chart, US's (whites) death rates takes off starting from late 90s, where the economy was doing great, while other countries' death rates keep declining even during great recession…

Or maybe no one gives a crap about white males; they are just mysoginist, racist, oppressors.

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#15

Post by tristor »

Another part of this I think that people don't really talk about is increased social isolation as a direct cause of Internet addiction and the rise of social media and online gaming. There is a term for this concept in Japan 'hikikomori', but it's just as true in the US.

As someone who recently turned 30, yet has remained single most of my life despite my other successes, I see it very clearly. I grew up along with the Internet as many people in my generation did. Even when around other people in my age group, everyone is disconnected from each other. There's less empathy and relationships in my generation feel more superficial. At any moment, someone will pull out a smartphone and be using social media while literally standing around with a group of supposed friends. I'd say it's the group of people I've hung out with if it weren't for observing the same in the wild many many times.

I think we still haven't figured out what all the unintended consequences from technology are going to be, and I wouldn't be surprised if we didn't end up seeing a sharp decline in the birth rate among whites in the US to go along with the increase in younger deaths. Not just because of the consequences of social isolation on mental health, but because the lack of social connectedness that exists today makes it almost impossible to actually procreate.

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#16

Post by distances »

One kind of a record in Finland was a man deceased for six years before anyone noticed. He had already mummified in his bed when found. Even the landlord didn't ask after him, as the rent was automatically paid by social services for this whole time.

There's also an English Wikipedia page of the case at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maunula_mummy.

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#17

Post by minikites »

tristor wrote: post #15

Another part of this I think that people don't really talk about is increased social isolation as a direct cause of Internet addiction and the rise of social media and online gaming. There is a term for this concept in Japan 'hikikomori', but it's just as true in the US. As someone who recently turned 30, yet has remained single most of my life despite my other successes, I see it very clearly. I grew up along with t…

>remained single most of my life despite my other successes

I think the media has a role to play here too, the idea that you need romantic love in order to be successful or complete is a toxic one.

Edit: a lot of replies to my comment are misinterpreting what I'm saying as "romance is a new idea invented by the media" when all I said is that it's possible to have a complete and successful life without romance.

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#18

Post by cousin_it »

baron816 wrote: post #4

All these problems (as the author mentions) are closely related to lower rates of social connectedness. This is obviously a huge problem, probably the biggest problem in the advanced world, yet it seems to be mostly ignored. My company, Krewe ( https://www.gokrewe.com ), is addressing it by trying to make it really easy for people to make a new group of friends in their neighborhood and become connected with their lo…

Imagine an old depressed person who needs a daily dose of human empathy, just like everyone else, but can't give anything in return. Can your startup help such a person? I'm with the other commenter, this is a societal problem. To make even a small dent, we need an army of volunteers with calliagnosia or Williams syndrome, or something even more drastic...

Re: Alienation Is Killing Americans and Japanese

#20

Post by simonbarker87 »

gkanai wrote: post #8
simonbarker87 wrote: post #5

Not the main focus of the article but I've been wondering lately why Japan is considered to have done poorly over the last 30 years economically when a lot of the big multi national brands that are very popular all over the world during that period are Japanese. I'm not an economist (or Japanese) but from the outside when you can list Toyota, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Suburu, Shimano, Nintendo, Hitachi, Yamaha, Sega and Mu…

> Can anyone share some insight? If you were around in the 1980s, when Japan was at it's economic peak, Japan has slowly been passed by China and continues to tread water (i.e. stay in the same place, as China has passed it.) Japan is a poorly performing economy in that there's been little to no growth since the bubble burst in the late 80s. Other economies have gone through growth stages and we had the Asian financi…

Thanks, very interesting. I wasn't born until '87 so all I've ever known is Japan as it is now rather than growing in the way China has been.
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