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React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

fullstackreact.com

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Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#231

Post by abritinthebay »

metamet wrote: post #225
joshmanders wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What the GP says is true: if you start using any of these JS tools prepare to switch them out every 6 months. As a full stack JavaScript developer, the tools I used over 6 months ago are also the tools I use today. Only difference is I left Angular for React. But my build tools are still the same. I use Gulp, SASS and Webpack. You're talking out of your ass if you actually believe something can get to the popularit…

I'm with you, but there's a strong point with Grunt vs Gulp. Gulp is the new standard, and it usurped Grunt only how many months ago?

Like... a year ago was the tipping point.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#232

Post by intrasight »

Chyzwar wrote: post #227
intrasight wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is much less tooling and much less churn even for a very complex Java application

When I see people in other teams fighting with Maven, Jenkins builds for weeks somehow I cannot believe this.

I didn't say that Maven wasn't complex. I said there are fewer tools and less churn. The advantage of Java dev is that you can justify the intellectual investment in the tools because there are fewer of them and they are going to be around for a long time. The same cannot be said about client-side development at this time.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#234

Post by spinlock »

rtpg wrote: post #181
fbonetti wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with the massive amount of churn is that it just doesn't pay off to learn the new, cool thing when it's going to be obsolete in 3 months or less. I think all programmers, especially ones who read HN, like to learn new things. It's fun to pick up new languages, learn new paradigms, and experiment with different technologies. What's not fun is learning 10 different ways to handle promises, 4 different build…

>it just doesn't pay off to learn the new, cool thing when it's going to be obsolete in 3 months or less. Does this actually happen? If you had learned Angular way back, you would still be in a comfortable situation. New stuff coming in, but it's compatible with the old stuff. Same with React. Had you learned react when it was talked about, you would have gotten, what, at least 2 years worth of value by now? And a lo…

We started a brand new project in Ember (our second Ember project) in December; launched it in January. We've now started another project in Untangled because nobody wants to work in Ember anymore (apparently, it stopped being cool last year).

So, yes, this actually happens and it's incredibly painful for those of us who want to build a business not throw everything out and start over every few months.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#235

Post by acemarke »

rvanmil wrote: post #203
duderific wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a couple of weeks ago I finally bit the bullet and taught myself webpack, ES6, React, CSS modules, Redux, and everything else that comes along with these tools Can you share how you did that? Was it a number of different resources you consulted, or is there some all-in-one resource you found?

These resources have been very helpful to me: http://survivejs.com https://github.com/markerikson/react-redux-links https://github.com/HenrikJoreteg/hjs-webpack

Yay! Very glad to hear that my React/Redux links list has been helpful. Currently working on trying to add in some more intermediate-ish topic articles, beyond the typical "getting started" tutorials.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#236

Post by spinlock »

joshmanders wrote: post #220
adamors wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grunt is actually not still fine to use. I've been burnt by a lot of plugins coming out for Gulp only and now for webpack only. What the GP says is true: if you start using any of these JS tools prepare to switch them out every 6 months.

> What the GP says is true: if you start using any of these JS tools prepare to switch them out every 6 months. As a full stack JavaScript developer, the tools I used over 6 months ago are also the tools I use today. Only difference is I left Angular for React. But my build tools are still the same. I use Gulp, SASS and Webpack. You're talking out of your ass if you actually believe something can get to the popularit…

The problem is working with fanboys who refuse to use the tools that you've spend a year or two investing in. When the people you work with throw away your projects every couple of months, there's nothing you can do to keep using what works.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#237

Post by spinlock »

tracker1 wrote: post #143
jimmytucson wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, but even the “Getting Started” guide on React's website requires that you have a "CommonJS module system" installed which, if you don't, means you have to make an intelligent choice between Browserify and webpack, which means you have to do some minimal research into what those are (and probably research "babel-js", while you're at it), install one of them using npm, which may require that you install or upgra…

By the same note, you likely won't be writing a complex desktop application without some tooling installed, with similar pre-requisites. I don't know why people get so irritated at "JS tooling is hard". Try writing an (INSERT FRAMEWORK HERE) app outside the browser. People assume that writing an APPLICATION for a browser is easy , which is why people get stuck maintaining monstrosities that are disorganized, not comp…

This is why I like Ember: you get setup in 2 seconds. Sure, I don't like all of the decisions they've made in the framework but it does work really well out of the box.

I think having a cli will become standard for JS frameworks. You just need to have the batteries included to capture the newb mindshare.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#238

Post by rvdm »

First off. Great tutorial! I wish more frameworks their native documentation would come with more real world examples. Redux's fantastic documentation is a step in the right direction but still makes real world solutions a bit too much of a side note.

Regarding Javascript fatigue, I want to share something that greatly helped me.

I have written enterprise applications for Fortune 500s using PHP, Rails, Backbone, Angular, React, Node, Express, Grunt, Gulp, Webpack, Yeoman, Bower, Redux, jQuery, Coffescript, Prototype.js ( remember them!? ), LESS, SASS... Basically whatever was hot at the moment.

Long I've enjoyed learning new things, but after having made a solid investment in Angular only to find out none of it's SEO solutions were really commercially viable the fatigue hit me hard and I gave up on trying to learn new things for a while. I simply stopped caring.

Then I got approached by SpaceX for a JS full stack position. All they told me about the interview beforehand was that it would be very JS heavy, yet no details on what stack or framework they were working with.

To prep I brushed up hard on my basic JS skills. Codeschool.com their JS road trip was very useful. So were "Eloquent JavaScript" and "JavaScript: The Good Parts".

After making that tough but very rewarding investment, learning React, Flux, Redux, Elm etc. all became a breeze. I no longer have any attachment to any framework. They're all just different ways of using JS to me. And no matter what the future brings, no matter how many frameworks and build tools get thrown our way, I don't think ( hope? ) my heavy investment in Javascript will soon disappoint.

So for those of you out there trying to figure out what to invest in next, React, Elm, RxJS.. My advice would be to get a deep understating of pure Javascript first. Ideally, try to build your very own framework using vanilla JS. Once you do that you'll find each new framework is just a different opinion on how JS should be used.

Many frameworks have come and gone. But after more than a decade of investing in the Javascript language, it keeps rewarding.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#239

Post by greenspot »

swanson wrote: post #48

I'm no Javascript Boilerplate Fatigue apologist, but there are many comments in here that are treating this as a "Learn how to use React" tutorial. This is not what is advertised nor the stated reason this article was written. From the first sentence: "we get a lot of questions about how to build large applications with React and how to integrate external APIs" Large application strucutre, external integrations...not…

Well said.

I like programming, I like different languages. Just few days ago I was once again lurking on other languages' sites and forums just to find something new. I realized when looking at other languages that JS has come a far way and now offers so much that I really like JS. I got spoiled and the urge to try, find and need something better has faded.

The language itself made huge leaps with ES6 and the ecosystem is just incredible. I see that fast pace as something positive and the 'JS churn' is relative or rather exaggerated. Node itself is very stable and new versions do not break old stuff in general. Grunt and Gulp got replaced by Webpack, React + Redux redefine UI. That's it, these are the typical examples in mind when people talk about 'churn', not really a lot to be worried about. And these changes didn't happen over night but over years, e.g. the first React version was introduced two or three years ago.

A counter example to churn: Express is still the to-go web app server for many years (5?), it's doesn't have the most modern foundation and other stuff (e.g. http2 is problematic) . I wish that new web app servers like Koa, Express' successor, would gain more traction but that happens only slowly.

Re: React Tutorial: Cloning Yelp

#240

Post by adamors »

joshmanders wrote: post #220
adamors wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grunt is actually not still fine to use. I've been burnt by a lot of plugins coming out for Gulp only and now for webpack only. What the GP says is true: if you start using any of these JS tools prepare to switch them out every 6 months.

> What the GP says is true: if you start using any of these JS tools prepare to switch them out every 6 months. As a full stack JavaScript developer, the tools I used over 6 months ago are also the tools I use today. Only difference is I left Angular for React. But my build tools are still the same. I use Gulp, SASS and Webpack. You're talking out of your ass if you actually believe something can get to the popularit…

You're arguing against a strawman, develop some reading comprehension before you insult people.
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