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Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

wsj.com

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Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#41

Post by dingaling »

mrweasel wrote: post #20
astazangasta wrote: post #17

Again, I deplore the colossal waste of human effort and talent that is going into building a sophisticated panopticon for the noble purpose of better targeted advertising . For fuck's sake, what a waste of the best minds of our generation.

I hate when people say that people who waste time on Facebook just need to show some willpower. As you say it's some of the best minds working on it. Pitching the willpower of a 15 year old against the combined minds of the Facebook engineers tasked with keeping them on the site, of cause the 15 year old (or 50 year old for that matter) will lose. And all that, so some company can blast us with adverts.

> And all that, so some company can blast us with adverts.

It is sad that they chose to build themselves upon tracking / data-mining / advertising.

Even if they charged a nominal fee[0] of $1 per month they'd have nearly as much incoming revenue and much lower overheads without having to develop and maintain all that creepy stuff. They wouldn't have to play psychological warfare, they could just focus on providing a good product.

'Facebook is free and always will be'. But at the cost of being regarded as malevolent and, therefore, ripe for disruption.

[0] I apologise if this is not nominal to a significant proportion of the user-base.

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#42

Post by EGreg »

sp332 wrote: post #33
tommeader wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that overkill? EFF Privacy Badger states that it's a one-extension solution rather than having ghostery, adblock + others: https://www.eff.org/privacybadger (2nd FAQ) I've never tried Privacy Badger myself, what's your reasoning for having both? Is it not quite as all-encompassing as it claims?

It's an anti-tracking extension, not an adblocker. uBlock Origin lets you sign up to custom lists and make custom rules which can include cosmetic filters. These are helpful for removing things from view even if they get loaded by your browser, which is darn convenient even though it's useless for preventing tracking.

With fingerprinting, what's the point of all this?

Browsers and Internet commections now have enough discoverable stuff via HTTP and JS to identify users uniquely enough that in 99% of cases the user's session can really get a unique id! Across publishers! Without third party cookies!!

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#43

Post by andy_ppp »

I'm seeing this now:

"To help personalize content, tailor and measure ads, and provide a safer experience, we use cookies. By clicking or navigating the site, you agree to allow our collection of information on and off Facebook through cookies. Learn more, including about available controls: Cookies Policy."

Am I signing a contract with Facebook by clicking on their website. Is that legal?

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#44

Post by joering2 »

Freak_NL wrote: post #15
userbinator wrote: post #5

while non-Facebook members can opt-out through the Digital Advertising Alliance in the US, the Digital Advertising Alliance in Canada, and the European Interactive Digital Advertising Alliance in Europe. Or you can just block all requests to their domains. I have *.facebook.com and a few others blocked.

So in order to protect my digital privacy, I should register myself at some alliance's website. It just doesn't make sense. Either this whole internet advertising thing turns out to be a bubble after all — in that case; let it pop, see if we can't figure out something better. If using ad-blockers and tracker-busters helps achieve that goal; good. Or we end up with an internet where all users settle somewhere on the p…

> So in order to protect my digital privacy, I should register myself at some alliance's website. It just doesn't make sense.

Of course it doesn't make sense, but if you have millions from a billion dollar pool to spent on lobbyist and all kinds of dirtbags that are in power, all of sudden rules that have sound people scratch their head, are norm.

> Either this whole internet advertising thing turns out to be a bubble after all

It is a bubble, indeed! The truth is that not enough people (businesses) have tried to find out on their own, so you have always fresh blood coming in!

I still get approached few times a month by a friend who own small business. The conversation goes something like this: "Wow Facebook has billion people in their database, and I can narrow them to age and interest. Oh I see 25 million people are my target audience wow if I get 1% of them purchasing my product, I will be filthy rich! And I'm talking about worst case scenario!" Then I go on into long explanation how people don't go to facebook to buy products but to watch silly cat movies their friends upload, I'm never being listened to. Until said friend drop in $150 as a test and get 80 clicks that got him one purchase for $20 worth of product. That's it. So this friend never advertise with Facebook again. But don't worry! There is probably half a billion others waiting to open the floods of business and riches for themselves by unlocking the doors to facebook advertising treasury chest.

Agencies and "those that know what they are doing" are not much better. They will tell you they help you advertise with good ROI, but in reality its the same as every advertising agency promising you first page of google. uhm, no. They all won't fit on the first page. Eventually once you burn $1k or few thousands with agency you realize there is a way to make some money but you would have to have budget in millions to break through with your product. So while Facebook is awesome for Coke and Pepsi to drop million buck before superbawl to fight for your mouth, the average person will usually lose money.

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#45

Post by distances »

sdoering wrote: post #10
eknkc wrote: post #3

Surprised they weren't doing that already. Facebook has javascript injected on a lot of sites, always assumed that they'd collect a shit ton of data whether you are a user or not. Also, all ad blockers block google analytics like tracking services but social plugins are generally opt in. I guess they should be blocked by default too.

I know a lot of AdBlocking Tools/List that do not block Google Analytics or Adobe Analytics by default. Do you know the ones that do?

uMatrix blocks all analytics by default.

I'm running uBlock + uMatrix. Very clean browsing experience. Also quite bare-bones before adding site specific rules, which probably won't suit everyone :)

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#46

Post by sp332 »

EGreg wrote: post #42
sp332 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an anti-tracking extension, not an adblocker. uBlock Origin lets you sign up to custom lists and make custom rules which can include cosmetic filters. These are helpful for removing things from view even if they get loaded by your browser, which is darn convenient even though it's useless for preventing tracking.

With fingerprinting, what's the point of all this? Browsers and Internet commections now have enough discoverable stuff via HTTP and JS to identify users uniquely enough that in 99% of cases the user's session can really get a unique id! Across publishers! Without third party cookies!!

Making it less reliable means the targeted ads are worth less money. Making it more difficult means it's less likely to be profitable.

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#47

Post by a3n »

eknkc wrote: post #3

Surprised they weren't doing that already. Facebook has javascript injected on a lot of sites, always assumed that they'd collect a shit ton of data whether you are a user or not. Also, all ad blockers block google analytics like tracking services but social plugins are generally opt in. I guess they should be blocked by default too.

I assume they've been tracking through Like buttons (clicked or not) for a few years, and now they've collected enough data to know how best to monetize it.

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#48

Post by a3n »

userbinator wrote: post #5

while non-Facebook members can opt-out through the Digital Advertising Alliance in the US, the Digital Advertising Alliance in Canada, and the European Interactive Digital Advertising Alliance in Europe. Or you can just block all requests to their domains. I have *.facebook.com and a few others blocked.

I tried it, selected "All" (130 participating companies), and only five opt-outs succeeded. Tried it twice.

And now those 125 companies (maybe the 130) know a little more about me, and may be able to fit me into a contrarian niche for more tightly focused advertising.

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#49

Post by tunap »

bballer wrote: post #26
sdoering wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know a lot of AdBlocking Tools/List that do not block Google Analytics or Adobe Analytics by default. Do you know the ones that do?

Just to add to the others comments, get NoScript and you can control exactly who gets to run Javascript at all times. It makes the internet so much safer and you will be blown away at how many domains some sites are trying to run scripts from.

Gotta 2nd NoScript for blocking all detritus from wasting my data caps & cpu cycles, although the default white-list needs much purging out of the box.

For added goodness, I also run the Blender Add-On[1] for the sites I do allow on occasion. I value my privacy MORE than the marketeers do.

[1]https://github.com/meh/blender

Re: Facebook will show ads to non-Facebook users on other websites

#50

Post by Balgair »

EGreg wrote: post #42
sp332 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an anti-tracking extension, not an adblocker. uBlock Origin lets you sign up to custom lists and make custom rules which can include cosmetic filters. These are helpful for removing things from view even if they get loaded by your browser, which is darn convenient even though it's useless for preventing tracking.

With fingerprinting, what's the point of all this? Browsers and Internet commections now have enough discoverable stuff via HTTP and JS to identify users uniquely enough that in 99% of cases the user's session can really get a unique id! Across publishers! Without third party cookies!!

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/random-agent-...
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