Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014) • Hacker News Board

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#21

Post by ribasushi » Wed, May 18, 2016, 7:09 PM UTC

igravious wrote: post #2

> The problem stems — yet again — from the disorder's fuzzy definition: grouping everyone with a diagnosis of major depressive disorder into one genetic study is like looking for the genetic risk factors for fever, explains Flint. “You would have lumped together autoimmune disease, infection, cancer and a whole set of different conditions.” This is quite the problem, yes. But ultimately the perceived intractability a…

> Absolutely the best book I've read on depression and suicide is Night Falls Fast ... I cannot recommend this book highly enough.

Honest question: do you recommend the book to folks suffering from non-trivial depression? As in: is there some sort of "happy ending" within the precise facts it lays out? Asking for a friend...

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#22

Post by reverius42 » Wed, May 18, 2016, 9:03 PM UTC

mr_tyzic wrote: post #19

jdpigeon wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it's complicated, because although you might get depressed to issues of the mind, once that switch has been flipped in your brain, then you do have a biologically-mediated disease and you're often totally fucked without some kind of medical intervention.

Everything in the mind is biologically mediated. That doesn't make every mind problem a disease.

Doesn't it? Replace the word "mind" with "body" and it seems like the very definition of disease.

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#23

Post by collyw » Thu, May 19, 2016, 10:44 AM UTC

mr_tyzic wrote: post #19

jdpigeon wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it's complicated, because although you might get depressed to issues of the mind, once that switch has been flipped in your brain, then you do have a biologically-mediated disease and you're often totally fucked without some kind of medical intervention.

Everything in the mind is biologically mediated. That doesn't make every mind problem a disease.

"Everything in the mind is biologically mediated"

Proof of that?

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#24

Post by maria_ » Thu, May 19, 2016, 7:22 PM UTC

As someone who suffered from a major depressive episode that nearly cost me my life, I certainly acknowledge it as a serious disease no different than cancer.

But thinking of it purely in those terms implies that the development of depression can be attributed and therefore remedied by addressing chemical irregularities in the brain. I used to believe that. It put me under stress and fear that somehow, randomly, because of some defected biological mechanism, I would fall victim once again to another episode.

It took me years to finally understand that that's an oversimplification of a highly complex illness. The chemical irregularities that characterize depression are influenced more so by emotional stresses and the interaction of an individual within the social environment, than say, genetics (it can increase the probability of development, but it needs to be "activated" by the environment). I think the best way to approach depression would be to identify and understand the condition not in isolation, but contextually as a coping mechanism to the stresses surrounding us.

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#25

Post by igravious » Sat, May 21, 2016, 11:49 AM UTC

ribasushi wrote: post #21

igravious wrote: post #2

> The problem stems — yet again — from the disorder's fuzzy definition: grouping everyone with a diagnosis of major depressive disorder into one genetic study is like looking for the genetic risk factors for fever, explains Flint. “You would have lumped together autoimmune disease, infection, cancer and a whole set of different conditions.” This is quite the problem, yes. But ultimately the perceived intractability a…

> Absolutely the best book I've read on depression and suicide is Night Falls Fast ... I cannot recommend this book highly enough. Honest question: do you recommend the book to folks suffering from non-trivial depression? As in: is there some sort of "happy ending" within the precise facts it lays out? Asking for a friend...

Sorry for taking so long to reply. I didn't know how best to answer you.

I do recommend it but not it alone. The books points to scientific studies of depression. A constant theme is nature versus nurture but always from the perspective of scientific studies, twin studies, demographic studies. What makes this book different though is that it contains short biographies of people who have taken their own lives which grounds the surrounding discussion in the human element. It looks at the history and current practise of dealing with mental health issues and shows us the barbarity and futility of many of the practises. It debunks myths. It evaluates theories dispassionately while at the same time having compassion for the sufferer. It's a beautifully written book. There is no "happy ending". But that's not the point, the point is to gain a better understanding of this huge social and personal phenomenon.

Hope that helps.

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#26

Post by mr_tyzic » Thu, May 26, 2016, 7:10 PM UTC

collyw wrote: post #23

mr_tyzic wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything in the mind is biologically mediated. That doesn't make every mind problem a disease.

"Everything in the mind is biologically mediated" Proof of that?

No proof, but I meant an implicit "even if you assume that" at the start of the comment.

Re: Medical research: If depression were cancer (2014)

#27

Post by mr_tyzic » Thu, May 26, 2016, 7:14 PM UTC

reverius42 wrote: post #22

mr_tyzic wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything in the mind is biologically mediated. That doesn't make every mind problem a disease.

Doesn't it? Replace the word "mind" with "body" and it seems like the very definition of disease.

By that argument, if you're grieving the loss of a loved one, deciding whether to marry, struggling to write a novel, or even fixing a bug in a computer program, you have a disease. All those presumably have some biochemical correlate.