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Hiroshima (1946)

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Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#181

Post by krapp »

nihonde wrote: post #171
krapp wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ironic thing is that I agree with you far more than I disagree with you, and I'm anything but "programmed to see America as the great liberator of the world". I would like nothing more than for the US to reduce its global military presence, because I think the age of nuclear superpowers and the "Pax Americana" is coming to an end, and, as you said, the US is becoming the problem. However, you seem to be incapable…

To be honest, I enjoyed this conversation, even though I probably project some unfair assumptions onto you. I'm an American myself, so I'm also well aware of the beautiful side of American life. I guess we're ultimately in agreement that the best of America happens when we look after ourselves and our own homestead, and the same is true of Japan. I just get so damn frustrated when America can't seem to resist the urg…

> I'm an American myself, so I'm also well aware of the beautiful side of American life.

Ah... that explains the sakura tinted glasses, then.

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#182

Post by ksou32 »

nihonde wrote: post #179
ksou32 wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the men in WW 2 were drafted. In that case I see no difference between a solder and a civilian. Truman's duty is to American boys who are dying in a war Japan started. He's wasn't the president of Japan You also have to factor in with any negotiation Japan may of argued they still owned Korea, as they'd had since 1910 In the Battle of the Bulge children were drafted,they magically become disposable war machin…

Truman's duty was to humanity, not "American boys".

Keep in mind millions of people are dying in Asia due to Japanese occupation during this time.

Shouldn't those lives count as well.

Ether way Truman was president of AMERICA, not the greater good

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#184

Post by niels_olson »

canjobear wrote: post #19
niels_olson wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having gone through Katrina and been deployed for Fukushima, I assure you, there is plenty of time for the survivors to contemplate all the questions. That is arguably part of the tragedy of survivorship: facing down all the questions, and knowing with cruel certainty there will be time to face them.

I also went through Katrina and the thing in this piece that reminded me the most of that experience was how people quickly became numb to the horror of their situation and dealt with things practically, one thing after the other. Or alternately became totally nonfunctional.

Agreed. Coming from the military though, it was actually somewhat reassuring. It was like going back to my old job: crisis becomes the daily grind.

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#185

Post by animeweedlord »

nihonde wrote: post #172
animeweedlord wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In American schools an overwhelming amount of time is spent teaching about the sins of our country and other white people. Slavery, Jim Crow laws, the genocide of Native Americans. In a unit on WWII, a week would be spent on the entire war, and the other 3 specifically dedicated to the Holocaust. All in all I'd say we spent over half of our history lessons and a third of our English lessons covering subjects like the…

Very true, and a great point. There are still gaps, though. How many schools teach you the reasons that Germany turned against Jewish people after WWI? In fact, how many schools teach the history of WWI in any kind of detail at all? And what about the reasons for the Southern resistance during the Civil War? My recollection (and I went to an expensive private school) was that these wars were characterized as simplist…

I was trying not to ruffle feathers, but that's what I was getting at. I was quite liberal as a teenager but even I could tell that history/social studies was mostly used as an opportunity to indoctrinate. The one teacher I had that tried to provide opposing views on every topic got canned.

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#186

Post by rosege »

stana wrote: post #52
pjys wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They sure teach the kids well in US schools.

I grew up in the Balkans and was taught in school that assassination of Franc Ferdinand in Sarajevo was jusified act to free South Slavic people from German oppression. To justify the aftermath of WWI - the education at the time said the World War I would have happened anyway. Moved out West and obviously introduced to a few different interpretations of the event, but it took a few years to start to question what I w…

maybe what you were taught wasnt so wrong - I've heard that the British (but I assume Germans, French too) were beginning to prepare for war and were expecting it to start

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#187

Post by dmfdmf »

krapp wrote: post #168
dmfdmf wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I was just joking" ...always the refrain of the scoundrel when called on their BS, at least in my experience. It is a strawman to imply that my position is that no one is allowed any contradiction or errors whatsoever. The issue is not errors of knowledge or mistakes but the failure to correct such errors when they are found. An honest man works to correct his errors and contradictions, i.e. is consistent, while the…

>It is a strawman to imply that my position is that no one is allowed any contradiction or errors whatsoever. It's also a strawman to imply that I ever implied that.

LOL, "strawman". I don't think it means what you think it means.

Don't think we didn't noticed that you ignored the fact that you misquoted Emerson.

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#188

Post by bluejekyll »

lujim wrote: post #165
bluejekyll wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're making the assumption that you -need- the other side to sign an agreement. Japan was completely contained by the US at this point in the war. This was a decision to hasten the end of the war, but did we ever actually leave? We still have bases in Japan. This was about hastening an end with a guarantee that the US would have full control of Japan. Please don't misunderstand me though, Japan needed to be defeate…

So maybe just a tug o' war or a water balloon fight to decide the winner of the Pacific War? We could have used those 1 million Purple Hearts we produced for the invasion of Japan for anyone who stubbed a toe during all the festivities.

Read Howard Zinn's, 'A People's History of the United States', then get back to me.

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#189

Post by lujim »

bluejekyll wrote: post #188
lujim wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So maybe just a tug o' war or a water balloon fight to decide the winner of the Pacific War? We could have used those 1 million Purple Hearts we produced for the invasion of Japan for anyone who stubbed a toe during all the festivities.

Read Howard Zinn's, 'A People's History of the United States', then get back to me.

I will check out a summary and if it looks good I will give it a read. My googling makes it look a bit revisionist but I will check it out. Since we are starting a book club try 'With the Old Breed' by Eugene Sledge and/or 'Flyboys' by James Bradley to see the hell on earth the Japanese military had exported all over the Pacific. I was actually somewhat mentally exhausted by the end of 'With the Old Breed' and was glad when it was over. The book described something horrifying and grueling with no end in sight so I can't imagine how it would feel to actually have lived it.

Re: Hiroshima (1946)

#190

Post by bluejekyll »

lujim wrote: post #189
bluejekyll wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read Howard Zinn's, 'A People's History of the United States', then get back to me.

I will check out a summary and if it looks good I will give it a read. My googling makes it look a bit revisionist but I will check it out. Since we are starting a book club try 'With the Old Breed' by Eugene Sledge and/or 'Flyboys' by James Bradley to see the hell on earth the Japanese military had exported all over the Pacific. I was actually somewhat mentally exhausted by the end of 'With the Old Breed' and was gl…

James Clavell's fictional account based on his experiences in a Japanese prison camp is wonderful read too, 'King Rat'.

I talked with my grandfather often about his service as a submariner in the pacific, brutal, but oddly he never hated the Japanese. He saved that for the French.

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