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Keep your identity small (2009)

paulgraham.com

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Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#81

Post by Spivak »

zyxley wrote: post #46
jleader wrote: post #28

One of the biggest invisible biases is thinking you've managed to free yourself of invisible biases.

I'm reminded of the inevitable "I'm not biased, but I'm going to complain about this because I think it's an attack on me" that comes up whenever anyone on the internet mentions that institutional racism exists.

You do understand the other side's situation right? You are, albeit impersonally, being accused of participating in something monstrous, the institutional subjugation and prejudicial treatment of an entire class of people, and there is literally nothing you can say or do which will demonstrate otherwise since your racist acts are unconscious and unknowable to you.

It's like trying to convince someone that you're not crazy when they already think you are. It doesn't mater, anything you say or do just reinforces their belief.

We all hold biases and prejudices for just about everything from concepts, ideas, products, institutions, and especially one another based on their history, race, creed, social status, clothing, voice, stature, hometown, manner of speaking, educational background, career field, job title, wealth, attractiveness, political beliefs, the list goes could go on for pages. But trying to equate these kinds of biases to being *-ist in any meaningful sense is missing the forest for the trees.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#82

Post by reitanqild »

douche wrote: post #67
zyxley wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Serenity Prayer may resonate with you. > God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, > Courage to change the things I can, > And wisdom to know the difference.

Better (and not tainted by association with AA...) I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Better ?

The first is shorter, less abstract and easier to remember.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#83

Post by iteoaf30nasfoi »

beatpanda wrote: post #49

This essay only works because Paul Graham is a white man in America, whose 'identity' is the presumed default in the society he lives in. Anything he makes a part of his identity, he gets to choose. If he chooses nothing, he has the luxury of being 'just normal' and gets to go through life thinking of himself as perfectly rational. Sometimes you get to choose what you identify with. Other times, people choose for you…

Couldn't you simply believe that for yourself, your biggest contribution to humanity is not politics? Plenty of people are plainly worried about it and discussing it in great detail. Why should everyone be bound to the same goals when their marginal contribution is just that.

This is not to say that you shouldn't participate if you feel compelled to, but unless you have an issue, isn't it mostly just a waste of time? What if you want to enjoy life and not feel angry all the time? If you have options, does that mean you should never ever exercise them in solidarity with those who have fewer?

Does not PG's advice apply to people without the ability to choose some aspects of their identity given that they have a universe of other traits they do have control over? Sure, one may be a dominant problem, but you can help yourself out by not adding more problems to your problems.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#84

Post by solipsism »

santoshalper wrote: post #61
reedlaw wrote: post #55

This is the weakest pg essay I've come across. I can think of so many counter-examples. "Stand for nothing and you'll fall for anything." It's very convenient to have a small identity with few convictions because convictions are costly. Sophie Scholl identified with anti-Nazi politics and it cost her her life. We have a word for people like her: hero.

Paul didn't say "have no convictions", he said "keep your identity small"... save your convictions for things that really matter, not stupid shit like sports teams, programming languages, favorite . I don't feel like you grasped the article clearly.

Seems like you didn't grasp the article clearly. PG says you can't think clearly about things that are part of your identity. You think he's arguing that you should choose things that really matter to be the things you _can't think clearly about_?

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#85

Post by pbreit »

ixtli wrote: post #74

> any mention of religion on an online forum degenerates into a religious argument. Why? Why does this happen with religion and not with Javascript Then later > the question of the relative merits of programming languages often degenerates into a religious war, because so many programmers identify as X programmers or Y programmers. Also as another poster said, this works because he's been able to go his entire life c…

I got the sense this article trended now because that's exactly where JavaScript/Node is right now.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#86

Post by pbreit »

pystack wrote: post #34

I've realized there are things I can change and there are things I cannot change. I try not to feel too strongly on the things I cannot change, because it distracts me from the things I can change. For politics, I try not to feel too strongly about Trump and the electoral process. I would still vote, but I know it would have a minimal impact, no matter how strongly I feel. Instead, I focus my energy on my business, w…

I think Suster was going there today: https://twitter.com/msuster/status/733330477046587392

People waste so much energy trying to change others when they could change themselves with practically no effort.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#87

Post by lliamander »

ixtli wrote: post #74

> any mention of religion on an online forum degenerates into a religious argument. Why? Why does this happen with religion and not with Javascript Then later > the question of the relative merits of programming languages often degenerates into a religious war, because so many programmers identify as X programmers or Y programmers. Also as another poster said, this works because he's been able to go his entire life c…

> If someone perpetrated violence on him because of something he _couldn't_ choose, say, his skin color, I have a feeling he'd be less likely to conclude that "The more labels you have for yourself, the dumber they make you."

I disagree. Each person reacts to circumstances differently. It might lead him to reject (what he perceives as) arbitrary labels all the more because others were using it as an excuse to hurt him.

And yes, these labels often come from outside of us, but I think his point is to resist internalizing them.

> The people to whom this "labeling" is most important are those who were labeled. Not those who label themselves.

I'm not quite sure what you are getting at. We all get labelled, we all have cultural scripts we are expected to follow. And yes, some have more negative labels. Are you saying such people are more justified in internalizing and defining themselves by their labels?

I guess I'm just curious as to whether you accept his premise that striving for a minimalist identity helps remain objective? Is it not worth analysing in our own lives what identities we have internalized that we could do without?

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#88

Post by abtinf »

ixtli wrote: post #74

> any mention of religion on an online forum degenerates into a religious argument. Why? Why does this happen with religion and not with Javascript Then later > the question of the relative merits of programming languages often degenerates into a religious war, because so many programmers identify as X programmers or Y programmers. Also as another poster said, this works because he's been able to go his entire life c…

If I attack you because your identity conflicts with my identity, say over differing skin color, then it demonstrates his original point: the label I've given myself is making me behave dumb/stupid/evil.

My action creates no obligation on your part to adopt the identity I've assigned to you. Your station in life has no impact on whether you will accept the label; you are a human capable of reason and you have free will - the choice is yours.

In literature, Tom of Uncle Tom's Cabin is a solid example of this. Tom, a heroic black slave, rejects the labels and associated moral principals others (both black and white) wish to assign to him. He acts in accordance with his self-selected moral convictions. And when confronted with an ultimate evil that demands the surrender of not only his body but also his reasoning mind - demands he accept an unchosen identity - he refuses.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#89

Post by sannysanoff »

The story about the person who kept his identity small, during WW2 ( https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007392 ) :

"""

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out — Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out — Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me — and there was no one left to speak for me.

TLDR: paul graham is sofa philosopher.

Re: Keep your identity small (2009)

#90

Post by sysk »

athenot wrote: post #53

I don't think it's so much about identity as it is about (in)security. Regarding politics, I completely follow his argument: I don't identify with any party and like to think I'm evaluating each policy on its on merits and according to my personal beliefs. Which leads me to the other one. I happen to be Catholic and strongly believe in the mental and societal framework put forth by that theology. However, I'm more th…

Just a nitpick but atheism is not a faith, it's the absence of faith.
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