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The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

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Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#171

Post by cmurf »

cloudjacker wrote: post #79
two2two wrote: post #29

TSA is the number one reason why I don't fly and drive instead. From my POV most of the world's industries have progressed positively, but not air travel. I took a train a couple of years ago and it was a beautiful example of old merging with new. Walking through an antique of a train station, iPhone in hand, with my digital ticket ready to board; so easy and pleasant. At that point I realized that air travel is by f…

I arrive at the airport in a Lyft. I walk up to the security checkpoint checkpoint, where I show the agent my phone. They see my boarding pass with the green checkmark and send me to the empty TSA Pre line. I walk through the metal detector with no adjustments to my attire. I am at the gate in 5 minutes. I like how trains basically let you show up last minute, and a 3 hour train ride actually means a 3 hour train rid…

Sure, why bother building a scalable system when you can build a classist one?

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#172

Post by a3n »

geophile wrote: post #150
cloudjacker wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I arrive at the airport in a Lyft. I walk up to the security checkpoint checkpoint, where I show the agent my phone. They see my boarding pass with the green checkmark and send me to the empty TSA Pre line. I walk through the metal detector with no adjustments to my attire. I am at the gate in 5 minutes. I like how trains basically let you show up last minute, and a 3 hour train ride actually means a 3 hour train rid…

I was flying with my wife, and we did a controlled experiment, since the Pre line and regular line both looked daunting. We got on different lines at the same time. We both took about 45 minutes to get through, but the Pre line was actually a bit slower.

But the person in the Pre line got to keep their shoes on!

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#173

Post by cmurf »

alexggordon wrote: post #125
yoo1I wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you need to do to be able to get this convenience ?

Because it abstracts security to something that can be done in the weeks before your flight, instead of vetting a person in the hour and a half beforehand.

Most travelers are repeat travelers. Exactly what vetting is being done for Pre that can't be done once in person that sticks with the person for 1-2 years and is renewable in a similar way as Pre?

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#174

Post by kyleblarson »

cloudjacker wrote: post #79
two2two wrote: post #29

TSA is the number one reason why I don't fly and drive instead. From my POV most of the world's industries have progressed positively, but not air travel. I took a train a couple of years ago and it was a beautiful example of old merging with new. Walking through an antique of a train station, iPhone in hand, with my digital ticket ready to board; so easy and pleasant. At that point I realized that air travel is by f…

I arrive at the airport in a Lyft. I walk up to the security checkpoint checkpoint, where I show the agent my phone. They see my boarding pass with the green checkmark and send me to the empty TSA Pre line. I walk through the metal detector with no adjustments to my attire. I am at the gate in 5 minutes. I like how trains basically let you show up last minute, and a 3 hour train ride actually means a 3 hour train rid…

The easiest way for the government to acquire biometrics on every citizen is to make non pre-check so painful that people willingly go the pre-check route. What's next? Don't want to wait 5 hours at the DMV for a license? Just let us inject this little tracking chip in your neck.

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#175

Post by fluxquanta »

jonnathanson wrote: post #89

The article is exactly right about what needs to be done, and who needs to do it: the airports themselves. No chance any elected official is going to scale back the TSA's screening creep at this point. The political risks of looking "soft on terrorism" are just too high. Imagine being a politician responsible for a TSA rollback, and then, by dumb luck, a terrorist attack succeeds a short while later. There may be zer…

>This is why it's in the hands of airports to push for any particular change. They're not running for office.

They rely on federal funding for new infrastructure, which brings more air traffic, which brings more gate fees, which results in more money for those running the airport.

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#176

Post by navait »

sowbug wrote: post #134
navait wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How about recognizing that 9/11 was a troll, and we fell for it? The attackers hated the U.S.'s idea of freedom, but they were too powerless to take away our freedom. So they figured out a clever way to make us take away our own freedom ourselves. And yep, we did exactly that. They didn't attack us because they "hate our freedom". Sure, they don't like western lifestyles or values, but that's not the primary reason…

That's good feedback. I don't understand the dynamics of the Middle East well enough, and as a fallback, it's easier to think in us-vs.-them dichotomies.

Thanks, I don't mean to pick on your comment specifically, but enough people repeat that idea that I wanted to point it out.

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#177

Post by logfromblammo »

Mendenhall wrote: post #23

In my personal experience what slows it all down the most is the actual people flying. Every time I fly I see countless people wearing tons of metal/jewelry/belts/whatever that they have to take off, often not till they are told to do so, the laptap is tucked far away until last moment. They still carry all sorts of lotions and liquids on for some unknown reason. When they then exit the scan they clog up the line by…

Don't blame the victims. You might as well say it's their fault because they didn't memorize the Gettysburg Address prior to arriving at the airport. What does reciting the Gettysburg Address have to do with airline security? About as much as making someone take out their nose and navel rings in the security line, and confiscating their hand lotion.

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#178

Post by ovulator »

capote wrote: post #35
ndirish1842 wrote: post #7

I wonder how autonomous driving will affect shorter flight commutes. I'll probably never take a car from Philadelphia to LA, but I might prefer to travel by car from Philadelphia to Chicago if I know that I can sleep throughout the car ride (as well as leave whenever is most convenient). When you take into account driving to the airport, checking bags, security, flight delays, baggage claim, and rental cars/driving t…

I wonder why so many people immediately jump to thinking about a car as an alternative to short distance air travel. Would people in the US never even consider a fast train system as a good option between Philadelphia and Chicago? (If it were built, of course. But self-driving cars need to be built too. But I guess they're easier; I'm just dreaming)

Is Philadelphia to Chicago short distance? It is the equivalent of Paris to Rome.

We have a very robust infrastructure for cars already in place, and it is pretty dynamic. The infrastructure for trains would have to be built and is a lot more static.

In the US cars are also associated with autonomy and independence. The train can take me from Philly to Chicago and I'm on it's schedule, but with a car I'm on my schedule and I can detour to Cincinnati or Detroit. In the US the needs of the individual for the most part trump the need of the masses.

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#179

Post by dragontamer »

ams6110 wrote: post #162
dragontamer wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 3. Profit! The Department of Homeland Security (of which the TSA is a part of) has a budget and its priorities are set in Congress. There is no "profit" motive here. The US is throwing money at this problem, and money that only creates inconveniences for us.

There is definitely a personal profit motive for the people involved, i.e. promotions and raises, having more reports (huge in the government sector), not to mention to crony pork handed out to companies providing the xray/detection and other equipment.

How does avoiding xrays and registering in pre-check create more reports and support pork-barrel contracts to x-ray scanner manufacturers?

Re: The TSA is a waste of money that doesn't save lives and might actually cost them

#180

Post by [deleted] »

Dayshine wrote: post #54
avn2109 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All those problems you mention are real, but they're not the main problem. The real problem with the TSA is that it's explicitly unconstitutional, since the 4th amendment explicitly prohibits search and seizure without a warrant. "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon…

Huh? Surely an organisation (i.e. an airline, an airport) can enforce searches as part of the conditions of travel.

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