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Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

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Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not accurate. "Permanent" means "something that lasts forever," not "something that lasts for a while, until it stops existing."

I got a job, permanent role. Does it mean I will live forever?

No, it means that the role will exist forever at that company, as far as anyone knows. It means the company has no plans to ever eliminate it. You may die or quit, but then someone else will be hired to do that job.

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not accurate. "Permanent" means "something that lasts forever," not "something that lasts for a while, until it stops existing."

Language isn't that strict.

It is. The fact that many people use language incorrectly is beside the point.

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got a job, permanent role. Does it mean I will live forever?

No, it means that the role will exist forever at that company, as far as anyone knows. It means the company has no plans to ever eliminate it. You may die or quit, but then someone else will be hired to do that job.

Except permanent jobs are frequently made redundant and cease to exist. The original intention may have been for the job to exist forever but things change, and permanent things cease to be so permanent. Much like countries...

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Language isn't that strict.

It is. The fact that many people use language incorrectly is beside the point.

No, it isn't. I suggest you read some of Wittgenstein's work on perfectly logical languages and how they're impossible.

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think your characterization of liberal and conservative is inaccurate. That can go without saying - did you really think that I was trying to comprehensively describe such complexity in less than a dozen sentences? I think your characterization certainly adds more color, but you go wrong with "they want to base their actions off of facts". It would be more accurate, and succinct, to say "they are utilitarian". Th…

Just wanted to say thank you to you guys for following up my comment with a couple that really made me learn and think a little more. As I approach my mid-30s, I realize that both liberals and conservatives are so incredibly biased in their first-principles that the ideologies will never reconcile. I just wish both sides realize their differences arise from differing assumptions, not differing conclusions. (The concl…

No problem. HN actively discourages this sort of discussion, for a lot of good reasons, but I can't really help myself. Because I can't help myself I'll take your "differing assumptions" and say that I see it like a disagreement over software design principles - rooted in a differing in cost/benefit valuation between the stakeholders. On one extreme end of the spectrum you've got anarchists who want a logically and morally consistent system that scales from a single individual to a society - which is like insisting that the entire software stack be formally verified. On the other extreme you've got statists that are largely unconcerned with implementation details that may be immoral and illogical so long as the end result mostly works - php web developers :) Both approaches have different costs and benefits.

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#286

huh? but ca and sf is two party consent? http://codes.findlaw.com/ca/penal-code/pen-sect-632.html

From your link: (c) The term “confidential communication” includes any communication carried on in circumstances as may reasonably indicate that any party to the communication desires it to be confined to the parties thereto, but excludes a communication made in a public gathering or in any legislative, judicial, executive or administrative proceeding open to the public, or in any other circumstance in which the part…

'public gathering' is perhaps intentionally ambiguous

the other disjunct: in any legislative, judicial, executive or administrative proceeding open to the public; led me to interpret 'public gathering' as bagley-keene(o) does

> 11122.5. (a) As used in this article, “meeting” includes any congregation of a majority of the members of a state body at the same time and place to hear, discuss, or deliberate upon any item that is within the subject matter jurisdiction of the state body to which it pertains.

stead of just anyone standing at a bus stop

(o) http://ag.ca.gov/publications/bagleykeene2004_ada.pdf

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just wanted to say thank you to you guys for following up my comment with a couple that really made me learn and think a little more. As I approach my mid-30s, I realize that both liberals and conservatives are so incredibly biased in their first-principles that the ideologies will never reconcile. I just wish both sides realize their differences arise from differing assumptions, not differing conclusions. (The concl…

No problem. HN actively discourages this sort of discussion, for a lot of good reasons, but I can't really help myself. Because I can't help myself I'll take your "differing assumptions" and say that I see it like a disagreement over software design principles - rooted in a differing in cost/benefit valuation between the stakeholders. On one extreme end of the spectrum you've got anarchists who want a logically and m…

Yes, this was a good discussion.

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#288
Many of us, in the Bay area Veterans community so agree with the topics and in one brand new book just released at www.barryeisler.com; civil liberties; rule of law, my community my neighbors, Please permit me to suggest his latest, just release book; "A God's Eye View." I for one like the one sentence in Chapter 47, "When you collect it all ;when you monitor everyone, you understand nothing." And a suggestion for the President's Blue Ribbon Panel for a position titled: " public interest advocate" is making more sense daily. http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2014/12/civillib...

I like the review Chelsea Manning gave of Barry, "Creepy. This story is much more plausible than I expected or care to admit." Salutes all too you for keeping me educated. As we said in my old army unit; "heart-faith-skill, the only way to win in a battle advocacy" (we borrowed it from Sean Connery as Ramirez in The Highlander Movie) peace..j.

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it means that the role will exist forever at that company, as far as anyone knows. It means the company has no plans to ever eliminate it. You may die or quit, but then someone else will be hired to do that job.

Except permanent jobs are frequently made redundant and cease to exist. The original intention may have been for the job to exist forever but things change, and permanent things cease to be so permanent. Much like countries...

As I wrote above, it means that the role is permanent as far as anyone knows. It does not mean that you will permanently be doing that job. It means that, based on all available current information, the job will continue to exist forever.

Of course, people can and do make mistakes. The fact that someone chooses to use a word to describe something does not mean that it's necessarily an accurate description. They may be lying, or they may simply have judged the situation incorrectly. How many startups say "we are the next Google"?

Re: Hidden Microphones Part of Government Surveillance Program in the Bay Area

#290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is. The fact that many people use language incorrectly is beside the point.

No, it isn't. I suggest you read some of Wittgenstein's work on perfectly logical languages and how they're impossible.

I've read Wittgenstein, and I wasn't terribly impressed.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is merely ignorant of the superior wisdom and knowledge you have attained.

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