you nerds are fucking cringeworthy
fire him, dont fire him, who gives a shit, are you 17 years old?
Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
461–470 of 622 posts
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#462She told someone up the management ladder. The business is now financially libel if the situation is not aggressively corrected.
This can also apply to customers, not just co-workers.
Lawyers, good lawyers that know harassment law.
Worked for a company that had to settle a lawsuit before I started there. Management meetings every six months on this the entire 5 years I worked there, part of the settlement.
I have fired a coworker and banned a customer for this.
In US.
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#463Don't fire without talking first. I'm not saying your innocent employee is lying but try to get both sites and possibly some proof (the messages).
/ EDIT: I missed the part where he said that he saw the evidence - sorry.
Why I'm saying this is because I was in a similar situation once. Employee X didn't like me without me knowing. At a party (alcohol involved) we talked a little (normal things, nothing sexually, personal, private or anything like it) and that was it. On the next day I got asked into the office and have been told that multiple people filed a sexual harassment claim against me. No names who that could have been, no proof, but I was guilty.
They told me that I either have to leave the company or send a public (anonymous) apology for the bad things I did. (They didn't even tell me the things I did)
Until today I can still only guess who it was and it perplexes me that "multiple people" filed that claim against me. After talking to my better friend coworkers it seems like all people that could have filed that were friends with that one employee X that didn't like me.
Long story short, I still don't believe I did anything that could have been even remotely near sexual harassment but I'm feeling horrible. Maybe the worst memory in my entire career. Every time there is a harassment training I get reminded of what happened and that there are indeed people out there that call me a "sexual harasser".
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#464> she really doesn't want to cause problem
> made it clear that it's not a big deal and she knows how to deal with it
Last year I watched an emotionally strong friend reduced to a terrified sobbing mess before he gathered the courage to go to his leadership about a sexual harassment issue with his direct superior. I know you won't take her grace for granted but please consider that how she really feels may be different than what she says in order to maintain professionalism.
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#465INAL, but here's what I think
> I'm really upset by this guy's behaviour and I want to fire him immediately.
If you are in the US, which that u in behavior suggest that you might not be...
If you have an established HR process you have to follow it. Otherwise fire him discreetly and then let people that hes moved on in a few days. Don't tell either him or the employee that came to you that it has anything to do with their interaction and if he asks specifically during the firing process turn the tables on him and feign unawareness and ask what the hell he is talking about. I wouldn't out her or acknowledge that you are aware of the incident to him at all. If the employee who confided in you asks if that why he was fired, just tell her that its a confidential matter and you really can't go into it. I live and work in at will state and wouldn't bother to lawyer up if I went this route (though it wouldn't be a bad idea), but I would wait til I was calm enough to leak that he had done something really upsetting.
If you want to make an example out of him (or keep him around) you definitely need to lawyer up.
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#466I don't know if what he was doing was 100% harassment or not but that word makes it at least hard to argue its not.
The sad reality is that if a man makes advances towards a woman at work and she isn't interested, it is very possible he will end up being terminated for 'sexual harassment' regardless of what words he uses. Because sexual harassment effectively really boils down to any unwanted advance or even flirtation. It shouldn't be that way, it should be about actual harassment, but very few people are able to make such a distinction in a fair way.
So I don't think that in the current environment any sort of flirtation at work is really a safe maneuver unless the woman makes obvious advances first.
I have a feeling people will slam me and this comment but I haven't been downvoted very much this week so I guess it is time.
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#467Man, talk about CYA answers. A lawyer is probably going to give an answer that covers their butt. They're going to chose the lowest risk legal route.
Your employee came to you in confidence. If there is a legal way out of this that doesn't break that (maybe requires a bit of extra work), I'd chose it.
You have to realize how this could blow back on her in a big way.
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#468You're in a bit of a quandry. He should be go, but it's not going to be easy.
If you fire him for this instance, you could be sued for wrongful termination, and in which case you would have to produce those whatsapp messages, and convince your employee that they were harmful.
> He asked to take the conversation off Slack (moved to Whatsapp) and asked if they could hang out (she said, "sure as friends in work context"), referred to her as a milf (ugh...), and asked if he could tell her a secret (she refused)
My interpretation was this person used Slack (work resource) to ask a coworker to switch to Whatsapp (non-work resource), during the weekend (non-company time). He proceeded to make inappropriate comments on whatsapp.
I'm not a lawyer, but from limited research, it seems that a few sets of inappropriate text messages (of which you dont approve of, but the recipient doesn't mind) sent over the weekend does not constitute workplace sexual harassment.
The employee has said "it's not a big deal." which even though you don't like it, means it's somewhat out of your hands.
The quandry is, the bizdev person is probably a bad fit for your company. You should get rid of him, but would need something more substantial in order to standup to a wrongful termination suit.
Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#469I think the reaction of this thread is a little over the top. Lets calm down and be professional and adult before we convict someone based on scant information. I know it is fun to rail on someone but firing a person is not a minor issue and could potentially destroy someone's career. The information we are presented with is minimal. This is perfectly understandable but it means that no one in this thread has anythin…
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Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?
#470Lawyer lawyer lawyer LAWYER lawyer LAWYER . I think the consensus in the grown-up business world is "fire immediately for cause." I would bet substantial money that when you lawyer lawyer lawyer they will advise you to do that and document the heck out of it. The calculus is really, really simple: if you don't, then you will with probability approaching one get this incident or a similar incident cited during a threa…
> Would you be worried about this if he had been embezzling?
That would be an egregious and illegal behavior taken against the company, and the company execs should take action.
However, this is a case of one adult sending inappropriate private messages to a co-worker (also an adult), but not on company time, and not using company resources.