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Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
41–50 of 157 posts
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#42buzzword filled click-bait. :/ just use your brain. agile is only a problem when people follow it religiously instead of intelligently imo. its just one tool in the box, not the ultimate methodology.
Agreed. But feel compelled to add: Agile is only a problem when teams pretend to follow it but actually don't.
When everyone misuses a tool, it's the tool's fault. And everybody misuses Agile.
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#43I like how he tries to supplant agile with something that doesn't even attempt to solve the same problems that agile (like waterfall before it) attempts to solve. Both agile and waterfall methods attempt to give you a pattern by which you can predict when software will be delivered. That's the main business value. The suits don't care how the devs operate, provided they can get things on time. Waterfall tried to do t…
The trouble is that in dynamic environments, the discipline necessary to properly practice scrum isn't really possible. It takes longer to define the requirements than it does to code, and once coded they change mid-sprint. The trouble with waterfall is that it tries to predict beyond the scope of a sprint, which just isn't valid. Project estimates are asymmetrical curves (likely poisson?) and you can't add them up a…
"It takes longer to define the requirements than it does to code, and once coded they change mid-sprint"
I've experienced one -or- the other of those, rarely both. The only times I've experienced both were due to product owners who wanted to be managers, to bring 'leadership', and so insisted on wasting my time with meetings that didn't actually lead to well defined stories.
If I've had a product owner who wasn't a waste of space, who met with the customer(s), actually understood what they needed, and then met with us to help define a story, then while that story might take a good 10-20 minutes to fully flesh out with good acceptance criteria, it almost never changed during the sprint. We might, on the demo and/or release of the feature, realize modifications were in order, but that wasn't because we did things incorrectly at first; we did them correctly, with something releasable, and useful, and that allowed us to learn something that helped us to refine it.
However, more often I've had product owners who are wastes of space. They'll slap a story together, maybe with acceptance criteria of a line or two, maybe nothing, and then hand it off to the devs to go do. We roll our eyes, make some assumptions for all the missing details, do something, demo it to the customer, and get "That's not what I wanted! Change it!"
The former is infinitely preferable. Even if it's a highly complex feature, that takes a while to get understanding and consensus on, it almost never changes once we do and the devs, customer, and product owner are all on the same page. The problem is it requires a product owner who doesn't suck, and the reality is most of them suck.
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#44"Continuous Delivery", huh?
Yeah, let's replace one consulting fad (the 4 or 5th I've seen in my career, I entered when "Waterfall" was still in vogue, then XP, then Agile, some variations of each too) with another.
How about this methodology: http://programming-motherfucker.com/
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#45buzzword filled click-bait. :/ just use your brain. agile is only a problem when people follow it religiously instead of intelligently imo. its just one tool in the box, not the ultimate methodology.
Well it's working, it's on top of HN. The problem is the people clicking in the end. I didn't, cause I know with a title like that this gona be some cheap clickbait.
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#46Not sure if I agree with his post, but to hell with the gurus! It's a mentality we need to move away from, and it is nauseating the way people drool over so-called 'gurus'. Software is not religion... it's just software
Unfortunately it sells, and idiotic managers love it because it gives them a ready-made recipe, instead of having them come up with something that works for their product and their team.
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#47Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's "Agile", the buzzword that all sorts of advice-givers have capitalized on commercially, and then there's the Agile Manifesto [1]. The Agile Manifesto has merit and is a set of values, not a methodology - it would precisely agree with your advice to chiefly "use your brain". It's unfortunate that the latter has been turned into a Frankenstein's Monster of the former. [1] http://agilemanifesto.org/
I hate to disagree since you support me, but thats not true. The agile manifesto has plenty of problems that should be obvious with some thinking. Some of the statements are outright ludicrous and naive as much as others are valuable insights (but even then, only if you haven't thought about the problem very much and tried to approach it in reality). I shipped software very quickly before learning much about agile at…
> The agile manifesto has plenty of problems that should be obvious with some thinking. Some of the statements are outright ludicrous and naive as much as others are valuable insights
Are we talking about the same document? What are the problems and harmful aspects that you're referring to? (Please quote the relevant part) This comment feels either a bit like a content-free middlebrow dismissal, or we're referring to different documents.
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
I hate to disagree since you support me, but thats not true. The agile manifesto has plenty of problems that should be obvious with some thinking. Some of the statements are outright ludicrous and naive as much as others are valuable insights (but even then, only if you haven't thought about the problem very much and tried to approach it in reality). I shipped software very quickly before learning much about agile at…
> The agile manifesto has plenty of problems that should be obvious with some thinking. Some of the statements are outright ludicrous and naive as much as others are valuable insights Are we talking about the same document? What are the problems and harmful aspects that you're referring to? (Please quote the relevant part) This comment feels either a bit like a content-free middlebrow dismissal, or we're referring to…
http://agilemanifesto.org/
http://agilemanifesto.org/principles.html
From the very first.
> Individuals and interactions over processes and tools
Have you seen this in practice and experienced how people work day-to-day? Leave them to their own devices and it varies a lot by personality. Some people need micro-management for instance... there is also thing that process is very important, and this point is self contradictory given that a lot of the agile manifest essentially describes process or a strategy for creating one... and as for ever relegating the importance of good tools.... ick.
?
(p.s. thanks for calling it out, its good to take these things seriously imo. its shows passion and care. :) )
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
Agreed. But feel compelled to add: Agile is only a problem when teams pretend to follow it but actually don't.
When everyone misuses a tool, it's the tool's fault. And everybody misuses Agile.
some over quoted thing about bad workmen comes to mind...
i prefer to think that a master craftsman is one who can take any tools and materials and use them to produce good work... if not exceptional.
Re: Agile Is Dead, Long Live Continuous Delivery
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