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WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

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Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#151

Post by blowski »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #116
rmc wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook/WhatsApp is trying to have it both ways. Either it's a for profit private company (and it can do things like that), or it's an important communication medium for a democracy (and access should be open). When it comes to blocking telegram, Facebook/WhatsApp wants to be the provate for profit company. When some judge blocks WhatsApp, suddenly they're an important service for a democracy.

> Either it's a for profit private company (and it can do things like that), or it's an important communication medium for a democracy (and access should be open). Blocking telegram is classic bone-headed stupidity. It's like an invitation for government lawyers to burrow under your skin and lay their eggs. But inconsistency only shows that one of their positions is wrong, and it's that one.

Paying an appropriate amount of tax in the countries in which it operates might be another. All that democracy stuff costs money and has to be paid for somehow.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#152

Post by nxzero »

lucb1e wrote: post #60
nxzero wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe this is obvious, or that I'm wrong, but the issue in Brazil is that most Brazilians are left-wing conservatives AND within in recent past put the current government in power. Long term this is the issue, not these "cyber attacks" - which are to me very problematic, but only a symptom of the issue.

I'm not sure which "cyber attacks" you are talking about. It's about a judge ordering Whatsapp to be taken offline for 72 hours for not complying with a court order, or am I missing something?

Quotes infer that it's a hyperbolic metaphor - and is used to express the degree of my disgust for a country "legally" attacking itself without good cause.

__

* Hyperbolic metaphor: https://sesquiotic.wordpress.com/2011/02/02/can-a-metaphor-b...

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#153

Post by hacksonx »

dmd wrote: post #138
lucb1e wrote: post #46

> the idea that everyone in Brazil can be denied the freedom to communicate the way they want is very scary in a democracy Says the person (in name of the company, I assume) whose company blocks things they don't "like", such as messages containing telegram.org or telegram.me[1]. Now Facebook is not a democracy and they can block and censor pretty much any message they like, but now they go on to tell Brazil how it s…

Linking to telegram works just fine. http://imgur.com/FOnR6ls

Just tried it with a couple of guys at the office, seems it is only blocked on Android. It works on WhatsApp web, Windows phone and on the iPhone.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#154

Post by saint_fiasco »

rmc wrote: post #144
simonh wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WhatsApp have testified about this before the Brazilian Congressional Committee on Cyber Crimes. There's no chance the judge isn't aware of it.

So if they're willing to send people to Brazil once, why not again?

It did not work the first time.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#155

Post by jim-greer »

lucb1e wrote: post #46

> the idea that everyone in Brazil can be denied the freedom to communicate the way they want is very scary in a democracy Says the person (in name of the company, I assume) whose company blocks things they don't "like", such as messages containing telegram.org or telegram.me[1]. Now Facebook is not a democracy and they can block and censor pretty much any message they like, but now they go on to tell Brazil how it s…

I can't reproduce the censorship of telegram.org.

http://imgur.com/qUjmS2n

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#156

Post by kuschku »

nihonde wrote: post #141
kuschku wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then don’t operate in the country.

They quite literally don't. They operate a service on a global network that can be contacted from Brazil.

Then they shouldn’t be surprised if they’re blocked.

If I operated a company in Liberland that had an onlineshop selling Crystal meth to customers in the US, my packages would also be intercepted.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#157

Post by sangnoir »

SEMW wrote: post #129
make3 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fucking dodgy/unacceptable. I know they did this for another site that gave money to people for spamming their connections with links to their website, which I guess is borderline acceptable. In the case of telegram though, there is no redeeming circumstance of any kind, they're just censoring for a business advantage [without it being directly visible to the user, which is even worse], and that's just really…

> censoring Classifying a recipient receiving a message containing exactly what the sender sent as 'censorship' just because they don't auto-link it is taking the word to new heights of rhetorical meaninglessness. Dodgy and scummy, sure. Mildly inconvenient for the recipient, definitely. Censorship, no.

> just because they don't auto-link it is taking the word to new heights of rhetorical meaninglessness

Whatsapp not only blocks auto-linking, but they also prevent the link from being copied to the clipboard. "Censorship" sounds about right.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#158

Post by nihonde »

kuschku wrote: post #156
nihonde wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They quite literally don't. They operate a service on a global network that can be contacted from Brazil.

Then they shouldn’t be surprised if they’re blocked. If I operated a company in Liberland that had an onlineshop selling Crystal meth to customers in the US, my packages would also be intercepted.

OK. If you look again at my comments, I don't disagree with you. I only speculated that WhatsApp has a sound reason for not turning up to answer the claims and for not keeping a presence in Brazil. If Brazil wants to shut them down, then it should (and did) do it. However, the service has apparently been turned back on. Maybe you should run for President of Brazil if it's important to you.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#159

Post by Ntrails »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #133
Loic wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know in which country you live, but I am very happy we have rulings here in Germany blocking access to businesses if those businesses are not following the law. WhatsApp, even if a US based company, is defacto providing a service in Brazil, it means they have to follow Brazilian laws. Dura Lex Sed Lex. You have more context on the other submission[0] showing that WhatsApp had way enough time to take the reque…

Blocking access should be a last resort, for businesses that are doing something extremely harmful. It's a consumer protection measure, not a punishment. If a business is breaking the law, you punish them with fines and the police, not by redirecting the mail/phone/packets directed at them. The citizens are the ones initiating contact with WhatsApp servers. They're the ones really being blocked here. Even though they…

>Sure they had time, but the request was physically impossible. What is supposed to happen if a judge demands a picture of you eating breakfast 8 days ago?

You go to court and explain it's impossible. Sticking your fingers in your ears and singing is a poor strategy and deserves to be punished.

Re: WhatsApp is back online in Brazil

#160

Post by lucastx »

marcosdumay wrote: post #45
lucastx wrote: post #30

We dodged this bullet but here in Brazil but RIGHT NOW there is a much more dangerous risk: with the Parliamentary Commission on Cybercrimes (CPI dos Crimes Cibernéticos / CPICIBER) report a "combo" of bills will get "fast track" on Congress and, to list some things, expand data retention, allow access to IP addresses without warrant and allow judges to block "illegal" content, including copyright violations much lik…

Your page isn't clear, what exactly happens tomorrow? Is it the final voting on the CPI? Or is there some law project under vote right now?

It's happening live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LNhAWbdrZA
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