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TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

nytimes.com

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Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#61

Post by vidarh »

VLM wrote: post #13
pionar wrote: post #2

I remember growing up as a lower-middle class midwestern kid, Roseanne was a show I loved, because I identified with it so much. Dan and Roseanne were my parents, and my friends were just like Darlene and Becky. Another similar show from that era is "Grace Under Fire". As a 35-yo upper-middle class guy still in the midwest, I look at what's on TV (both broadcast and Netflix/Amazon/etc.) and see none of that represent…

Having lived thru that era, and having been a poor starving student around the time of Married with Children, my experience was they bolted on the poverty but never internalized it to the show. The characters clothing budget exceeded mine by a factor of perhaps 100, their house and possessions were fancier than my parents by a large factor (and my parents were pretty well off, wealthier than I'll ever be) and when th…

They were basically low class, not lower class.

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#62

Post by Touche »

jerf wrote: post #53
Touche wrote: post #11

I think television just reflects the career-obsessed nature with society today. Characters are not just competent employees, they tend to be excellent at their jobs (top of their field, seemingly) while spending very little time doing their job. I don't know if blue-collaredness is looked down upon, but it feels like writers go out of their way to let it be known that the characters we are supposed to like, are extra…

"Characters are not just competent employees, they tend to be excellent at their jobs (top of their field, seemingly) while spending very little time doing their job." I think that's more "needs of drama" than anything else, though. It's basically impossible to show somebody doing a job on TV. You can show the social interactions, you can show very carefully selected highlights, you can show quick dramatized represen…

It's important because, on a lot of shows, the character's career is part of their identity. Yes, it's an unrealistic portrayal for dramatic effect. But that doesn't mean it's not a reflection of society.

Even in shows where the career is not a big part of the plot it's still pervasive. On Modern Family everyone has upper middle class white collared jobs; small business owners, real estate agent, lawyers. On How I Met Your Mother; architect, news anchor, etc.

Interestingly I don't think upward mobility is a big part of it. It's career achievement for the sake of career achievement. You hardly every see characters' lifestyle changing when they get big promotions.

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#63

Post by dominotw »

saturdaysaint wrote: post #59

There are lots of prominent counterexamples. The Office was a pretty direct attempt at making a modern middle class show. Breaking Bad at least started with one man's middle class problems. I think the main artistic factor here is that the sitcom, an awfully convenient medium for telling middle class stories, is dead. A 30 minute comedy where every episode was basically an island could be an oddly touching medium to…

>consumers don't have that much interest in slices of everyday life

Last weekend I watched amazon original 'catastrophe' and 'lilyhammer' a netflix original. Both of these revolved around ordinary people doing everyday stuff.

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#64

Post by nommm-nommm »

arethuza wrote: post #49
herbet_gayson wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd describe a nurse, a teacher, and yourself as upper class? You'd put them in the same social strata as the Queen of the UK or the Prince of Monaco? That's absolutely crazy. To me upper class means the literally Queen, or at least something like her cousin's son's uncle or something like that. If you don't own a country estate or have any staff then you aren't upper class.

I think you are using the traditional UK definition of "upper class" while nommm-nommm is using the US definition - they are completely different things.

Correct. I started with "in the US" and was replying to ". In the US, it means that maybe you own a house."

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#65

Post by Touche »

saturdaysaint wrote: post #59

There are lots of prominent counterexamples. The Office was a pretty direct attempt at making a modern middle class show. Breaking Bad at least started with one man's middle class problems. I think the main artistic factor here is that the sitcom, an awfully convenient medium for telling middle class stories, is dead. A 30 minute comedy where every episode was basically an island could be an oddly touching medium to…

Didn't basically every character on The Office become the manager at some point? It felt like it. Jim left the company for a while to start a sports agency or something? The Office definitely fell into the modern trap of every character needing to be upwardly mobile.

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#66

Post by untog »

Touche wrote: post #65
saturdaysaint wrote: post #59

There are lots of prominent counterexamples. The Office was a pretty direct attempt at making a modern middle class show. Breaking Bad at least started with one man's middle class problems. I think the main artistic factor here is that the sitcom, an awfully convenient medium for telling middle class stories, is dead. A 30 minute comedy where every episode was basically an island could be an oddly touching medium to…

Didn't basically every character on The Office become the manager at some point? It felt like it. Jim left the company for a while to start a sports agency or something? The Office definitely fell into the modern trap of every character needing to be upwardly mobile.

I think it fell into the TV show trap of being successful and having your actors be in demand, and taking time off from the show or leaving it altogether. They likely should have ended it when Steve Carrell left.

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#67

Post by Jtsummers »

percept wrote: post #51
Touche wrote: post #11

I think television just reflects the career-obsessed nature with society today. Characters are not just competent employees, they tend to be excellent at their jobs (top of their field, seemingly) while spending very little time doing their job. I don't know if blue-collaredness is looked down upon, but it feels like writers go out of their way to let it be known that the characters we are supposed to like, are extra…

They don't go to the bathroom much, either.

Going to the bathroom is rarely a defining characteristic of a person. A persons job or career, however, is a large part of their identity.

By what they do and the motivation to do it (teachers, nurses, doctors that see it as a calling, versus those that see it as a job). By constraining their lives (same examples, nurses with 12 hour shifts 3 days a week, severely constrained and stressed, but then 4 days to decompress gives them some greater freedom to pursue other interests than a typical 9-to-5 employee, but the stress may be too much anyways). By defining who they're in contact with (constant contact with coworkers, do they become friends, enemies, merely people you work with). By defining how much time you can spend on holidays (1 week, 2 weeks, a month?), which determines what you can do with leisure time. Income levels, again defining what you can do with leisure time, or at least constraining it if income is too low.

Unless someone's going to the bathroom frequently or painfully due to a medical condition (IBS, kidney stones, bladder infection, etc.), they likely aren't finding their lives terribly constrained or defined by that element of their existence. So in a drama it has little value, perhaps more in a comedy depending on the sort of humor they're going for (see Family Guy).

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#68

Post by gardano »

miiiiiike wrote: post #42
pessimizer wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Better Call Saul is about a family of lawyers, the Big Bang Theory is about academics, and Silicon Valley is about tech millionaires. I'm not sure what you're seeing there.

Better Call Saul is about a low-level grifter from Chicago who slept on a pull-out in his office after working his way out of a mail room. The Big Bang Theory has two characters who worked as waitresses. One a struggling actress, the other putting herself through school. The Silicon Valley guys were broke. Jared lived in a shed. Two of them are great shows, you should watch 'em!

I enjoyed that built-in ambiguity in your comment. I know which 2 I enjoy!

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#69

Post by alistairSH »

Sacho wrote: post #32
icebraining wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see that implication in OP's post..?

You are right, the implication is actually that "blue-collardness" cannot be extraordinary, but that flies in the face of common sense, considering all the stories about courageous and heroic policemen, firefighters, and so on.

Certainly true. However, note that the blue collar jobs you mention are "career" blue collar jobs. They occupy a different place in society than "just a job" blue collar roles. You don't often hear stories about heroic stock boys or shoe salesmen.

Re: TV’s Dwindling Middle Class

#70

Post by pavel_lishin »

dominotw wrote: post #63
saturdaysaint wrote: post #59

There are lots of prominent counterexamples. The Office was a pretty direct attempt at making a modern middle class show. Breaking Bad at least started with one man's middle class problems. I think the main artistic factor here is that the sitcom, an awfully convenient medium for telling middle class stories, is dead. A 30 minute comedy where every episode was basically an island could be an oddly touching medium to…

>consumers don't have that much interest in slices of everyday life Last weekend I watched amazon original 'catastrophe' and 'lilyhammer' a netflix original. Both of these revolved around ordinary people doing everyday stuff.

I'm not sure if I would classify the protagonist of Lillyhammer an "ordinary person" doing "everyday stuff".

(I do, however, very highly recommend the series. I've only seen Season 1, but it was fantastic, and the character's slow immersion into the local language and culture was very well done.)

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