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Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

nytimes.com

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Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#271

Post by JupiterMoon »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #182
tehwebguy wrote: post #25

Here's an awesome TSA story for you: Late last year while trying to fly out of LAX a TSA employee thought I was carrying a throwing star. They called the police, who correctly identified as a toy in seconds. I thought the whole ordeal was over until I got a "notice of violation" in the mail from TSA 45 days later. Now I'm banned from pre-check for three years, even though I have global entry and even though the fine…

>Some shit head got a gold star for "finding a weapon" and I get fucked. Everything about security and law enforcement has some level of perverse incentives. People learn to game the system and their supervisors don't care as long as there's a benefit to them. I'm certain this guy knew it was a toy, but he wanted that gold star and his supervisor wanted a report showing all the gold stars that month were from his guy…

Contracts for private sector companies doing work for the public sector tend to protect the private sector company from being fired. Also you may want to check who sits on the boards of some of the private contractors working for your government (or you might not want to - the results might make you more cynical).

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#272

Post by [deleted] »

tehwebguy wrote: post #49
raldi wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of toy was it?

It was from League of Leagends (Sivir). It's not sharp or aerodynamic, just a "spinner" toy. One of the vendors from the League convention I put on gave it to me as a token of thanks just before the event ended. I dropped it in my bag and forgot it until flying a few weeks later. Bonus: My business partner was given the same one and the same thing happened at BUR. TSA asked if she wanted to mail it home, she said "to…

[deleted]

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#273

Post by tomsaffell »

tlrobinson wrote: post #261
nfriedly wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're just as bad at identifying actual "weapons": I flew to South America with a layover in Miami a few years back. Got past TSA without any trouble on the domestic leg, then I had to go through again for the international leg. The second time through security, they said they saw a blade on the x-ray.. turns out they were right. I forgot I had left a multi-tool in my bag. Thankfully, they just trashed it and let m…

My friend accidentally took a multi-tool through airport screening shortly after 9/11 and had to lawyer up to get the resulting shitstorm to go away (and he's white and an American citizen) On the other hand, I remember when I was a kid in the 90s and accidentally took my pocket knife (3" blade) through screening, and they found it but let me bring it on the plane...

I accidentally took a multi-tool (with several blades) through an airport security checkpoint 2 weeks after 9/11. It was found on my person, and confiscated. I was told I could collect it on arrival at the 'weird items' desk at London Heathrow baggage claim. When I arrived a Heathrow it was waiting for me in a padded envelope at the desk.

I was flying out of Beijing, you know... that country with terrible human rights... To be clear: there are multiple human rights issues in China, many of which are far worse than the US. Just not everything.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#274

Post by seanp2k2 »

henrikschroder wrote: post #252
peterwwillis wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FYI you are allowed to carry on screwdrivers, wrenches and pliers less than 7 inches long. More bulky than a multi-tool, but at least you can carry something? https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/prohibited-ite...

Once I was flying out of Stockholm, and behind me in the security check was a handyman who was just passing security to fix something on the inside. He had a small open toolbox on wheels with him, so after I went through the metal detector, they pushed his box through, which obviously beeped, since it was full of screwdrivers, knives, hammers, and a lot of other sharp metal things. And then the handyman went through,…

Ooh yeah, in between times when they're actively inspecting YOU, it'd be totally trivial to hand things off and circumvent their "secure" zone. Thinking about all the ways you could sneak something through if you wanted to is always entertaining while I'm waiting.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#275

Post by dclowd9901 »

jerf wrote: post #97
Hondor wrote: post #35

If a terrorist wanted to kill a lot of people confined into too small space to run away, what better target than these densely packed zig-zag queues? Really, what's the point of protecting a plane carrying hundreds of people by putting those same people into harm's way like that? It already happened in China - Muslim terrorists killed dozens of people waiting in a ticket hall a couple of years ago.

There are a large number of places with densely packed people. The unique thing about airports is their access to airplanes and their capacity to be used as weapons. (I'm taking a broad view of "weapon" here; even old-school hijack-and-divert is still a political "weapon".) If it weren't for that, they wouldn't be particularly interesting and wouldn't need special security. If someone blows up the line, well, they di…

If the point (if there is a point) of terrorism is to "terrorize", I can't think of a better way than making me sweat for 3 hours in a huge line wondering if some maniac's going to come in and start spraying bullets or exploding, or perhaps opting out of traveling altogether. OP has it exactly right. Airplane hijackings get a lot of attention, but being afraid of even mundane activities is downright terrifying.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#276

Post by nostrademons »

koolba wrote: post #99
tehwebguy wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was from League of Leagends (Sivir). It's not sharp or aerodynamic, just a "spinner" toy. One of the vendors from the League convention I put on gave it to me as a token of thanks just before the event ended. I dropped it in my bag and forgot it until flying a few weeks later. Bonus: My business partner was given the same one and the same thing happened at BUR. TSA asked if she wanted to mail it home, she said "to…

> Bonus: My business partner was given the same one and the same thing happened at BUR. TSA asked if she wanted to mail it home, she said "toss it" and never heard another word! Free business idea! UPS/FedEx/USPS packaging site at the end of the TSA line. When they say you can't take your cologne, knife, or toothbrush because it's too dangerous, you can immediately give it one of our helpful agents and they'll instea…

They have this at many airports, but the prices are exorbitant. It was something like $10 to mail a swiss army knife home (vs. $15 to just replace it). They have a captive monopoly - there is one place you can mail it from, you can't step out of the terminal, and you have to decide immediately if you want to toss or mail - so they can charge whatever they want.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#277

Post by nommm-nommm »

spinlock wrote: post #245
lostInTheWoods3 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a wine opener confiscated because of the 1 inch knife ... can't imagine how someone might use a wine opener to hijack a plane

The 9-11 hijackers used razor blades. So, its been done. Of course, no American passenger is going to believe that everything will be fine if they comply these days so I don't think its possible to pull off 9-11 again.

There is a huge difference hijacking protocol between now and 9/11.

Post 9/11 passengers are not going to allow a guy with a razor blade hijack a plane, or even several guys with razor blades. Passengers and crew members now fight back and have the advantage of numbers.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#278

Post by spdustin »

mikey_p wrote: post #199
spdustin wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You stated a fact alongside your opinion, that a large portion of the TSA's operation includes seizing drugs. Do you have a source for this?

Not sure about other places, but who do you think is enforcing this in Portland? http://kptv.images.worldnow.com/images/8324399_G.jpg

I wouldn't think they'd have the authority to seize the drugs themselves, since the warning sign is from the Port of Portland, the governmental authority that oversees PDX as well as marine ports. My feeling is that they would be obligated to attempt to hold the bag (less likely) or flag the bag and passenger (more likely) for a Port Authority Police officer to handle.

EDIT: According to one story [0], the TSA cooperated as, essentially, an "informant" for the DEA, flagging those with large quantities of cash, for the DEA to then seize or investigate.

EDIT 2: In fact, the TSA policy is to keep dangerous materials off aircraft, but they have no real enforcement authority. Law enforcement gets involved when, for example, narcotics are found. "While TSA works to keep dangerous items off of commercial aircraft, when contraband is found, it must be reported to local law enforcement. Here are a few of the more notable narcotics discoveries:" [1].

0: http://dailysignal.com/2016/01/21/how-the-tsa-and-drug-enfor...

1: http://blog.tsa.gov/2015/01/tsa-2014-year-in-review.html

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#279

Post by sampo »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #192
CaptainZapp wrote: post #24

This, in combination with American airports being completely ignorant to the transit concept must cost American airline companies dozens, if not hundreds of millions a year in lost revenues. Case in point: if I want to to fly from Zurich to Lima I have essentially two choices: I can connect either in Amsterdam, or in Madrid. Madrids legal connection time is 55 minutes max (on Iberia). In AMS on KLM it's a maximum of…

Oh come on. I fly through Europe twice to three times a year. The transfer from Charles de Gaulle is a nightmare worse than any major US airport. They literally make you leave the security area and go through security for simple transfers if you're coming from the states. That's shit design right there. A lot of international connections are terrible and knowing which airports/airlines do a good job is important. Its…

> The transfer from Charles de Gaulle is a nightmare

You just picked the worst airport in Europe as the example.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#280

Post by superuser2 »

enraged_camel wrote: post #187
superuser2 wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please fund them fully or eliminate them entirely. The inbetween states just suck for everybody.

What will funding them "fully" accomplish? Do you believe that their inability to catch terrorists is a matter of lack of funding?

More parallelism in security checkpoints, less waiting in line.

The situation for travelers is worse, not better, if the TSA is understaffed but still present.

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