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Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

nytimes.com

121–130 of 512 posts

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than just membership fees. To join a precheck program, you need to submit personal information that they constitutionally can't force American citizens to provide, even at international borders: fingerprints and retina scans. So basically they hold huge amounts of your time hostage in order to force you to provide what ought to be protected info. It's similar to incentives for long-term contraception. The…

No retina scan for PreCheck, that's for Global Entry / Nexus.

Yea, thanks. I was being sloppy and using "a precheck program" to refer collectively to Global Entry, Nexus, and PreCheck. Obviously, the argument still applies to PreCheck with regard to fingerprints.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#122
I really do wonder how many terrorist plots have actually been foiled by TSA/ security staff.

They seem to just be following guidelines with ZERO common sense. E.g. most screw drivers ok, but not safety scissors. My biggest pet-hate is the ban on liquids over 100ml, anybody with a basic knowledge of chemistry knows that explosives (by their very definition) are volatile and you really do not want to start drinking any.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, the TSA sucks big time and should be abolished. I get that. But what about the alternatives? In this day and age it's just not thinkable to let people enter a plane without a security check. So you need some entity performing it. I think one factor on providing successful and to the passenger acceptable (they will never be pleasant) security checks is adequate funding and employing adequately compensated professi…

I think the original plan was that the TSA would set some rules and make the airports comply with them, and the airports would be responsible for doing screenings. Somehow that got warped into government agents doing the work. Why is it 'unthinkable' to let people enter a plane without a security check? We let people get on a bus without a security check. If you're worried specifically about someone taking over the p…

>> "...the original plan was that the TSA would set some rules and make the airports comply with them..."

The TSA was created solely to transfer liability from the airlines to the government in order to prevent the airlines from being sued into oblivion after 9/11. As nice side effects, it trains the population to accept the trappings of the police state and to disregard the sanctity of the 4th Amendment while proliferating bureaucracy.

But the main purpose is corporate welfare for commercial passenger aviation.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the original plan was that the TSA would set some rules and make the airports comply with them, and the airports would be responsible for doing screenings. Somehow that got warped into government agents doing the work. Why is it 'unthinkable' to let people enter a plane without a security check? We let people get on a bus without a security check. If you're worried specifically about someone taking over the p…

Then we probably have to agree to disagree. Air travel is in that sense special that you and up to 500 of your fellow passengers are in a metal tube in 12'000 metres height, which makes it conceptually a bit different from a bus, or even a train. Cockpit doors are already re-inforced, but the cockpit is not the only sensitive part of a plane when a passenger wants to cause mayhem with a high powered rifle, or a - pis…

A normal metal detector will deter the open carry zealots. What's wrong with pre-911 security + reinforced cockpits?

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than just membership fees. To join a precheck program, you need to submit personal information that they constitutionally can't force American citizens to provide, even at international borders: fingerprints and retina scans. So basically they hold huge amounts of your time hostage in order to force you to provide what ought to be protected info. It's similar to incentives for long-term contraception. The…

No retina scan for PreCheck, that's for Global Entry / Nexus.

No retina scan for anything, actually.

NEXUS uses iris scanners [1] for biometric identification. In fact, pretty much anything that is reported as using a 'retina' scan is probably not, and is also an iris scan. Retinas are pretty useless as a biometric, and are quite hard to scan without opthamological equipment. Irises have the dual benefits of being unique to the individual, and visible on the outside of an individual.

[1] http://usa.immigrationvisaforms.com/travel/nexus-iris-scan-l...

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#126

Seems like a perverse incentive to let them slow down the lines so you have to buy a "membership" in their precheck program. "Nice flight you have there...be a shame if you missed it."

They did exactly that at MSP (Minneapolis/St. Paul), almost literally. They recently consolidated the checkpoints from 4 down to 2. No one knows why, but they did. Security immediately went from 30 minutes to 2 hours. They blamed everything from funding (which they received $91 million more than they asked for in 2016) to people's bags (which somehow changed overnight). When the local government and our fed reps comp…

Ughh ... I am a regular user of MSP and was not aware of these changes:

https://www.minnpost.com/dc-dispatches/2016/04/what-s-really...

My pro tip is to fly sun country - you go from the international terminal in SFO to the HHH terminal in MPLS, both of which are nice, clean, modern and underutilized.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, the whole point for why pre-check exists is to allow frequent travelers who will always pass screening to get through the security clusterfuck faster. pre-check is for people that know how to travel and are willing to observe the rules. A grown man carrying a "throwing-star" toy through pre-check SHOULD BE banned from this privilege and feel the scorn of other pre-check folks who just want to go through smoothly…

I hope you never find yourself on the other side of someone with the badge, even though these people don't even have the power to arrest me it was very scary feeling like they thought I was a criminal and nothing I could say could convince them otherwise. "Did you know what you did was a felony? Did you know it's illegal to possess one of these?" - that's what I had to endure until the police arrived. For the crime o…

Yes, think about what you're putting in your bag.

It is sad that TSA is just a bunch a phony-baloney security theater, but that's not going to change anytime soon. In the meantime please be careful about what you put in your bag so that you don't delay others. Airports are stressful enough already.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#128
I have PreCheck, first due to my frequent traveler status with my (at the time) favored airline (which, as I understand it, PreCheck doesn't offer any longer) and then as a paid member, when I noticed that over ten consecutive entries, I was redirected to the non-PreCheck screening side 8 times (it now happens much less).

When I fly out of Houston's IAH (Terminal A), I routinely get mixed into the same screening area as non-PreCheck travelers (after a shorter line for the travel document checks). I show my boarding pass on my phone or my watch with the little check mark when I enter the screening area to an agent that never scanned my boarding pass, nor have they been in communication to the agent who did scan my boarding pass. They visually check that the checkmark logo is there, then orally call out to the machine operators that I'm PreCheck, and I don't have to take out my laptop or take off my shoes/jacket.

I also got grandfathered with a tiny membership rate into the CLEAR program in its current (second) generation, a program that doesn't hide its commercial status at all, and says clearly "pay for this and you'll have zero wait". I get to IAH Terminal A, tell the CLEAR agent I'm a member, and they quickly computer-scan my pass and verify my fingerprint. They walk me to the TSA podium, flash their CLEAR ID badge, and tell them my identity and boarding pass was verified (and that I'm PreCheck, since my known traveler number is associated with my CLEAR account as well). One more quick scan of my pass and I'm through the longest part of the wait: waiting for them to check my ID. I'm through security even on the busiest of days in about 15 minutes, mostly in 5 minutes. I know the wait time would grow again if everyone had CLEAR, but the ID verification part would be super fast.

Security lines themselves only seem clogged up by people who don't follow the rules (because they aren't frequent travelers) or who object to them. I don't agree with the rules, I write my congressperson to object to them, and I'm embarrassed by them when I'm speaking with people who don't live in this country. But until my letters to my congressperson (the method by which "We The People" can actually influence our government) are joined with millions more, security theater will remain.

CLEAR showed me that ID verification with PreCheck (since they have your fingerprints anyway) could be quick and efficient. It isn't. Some US airports have security lines that move quickly even in the busiest times, because agents are helping passengers comply in advance with rules with which many travelers are unfamiliar. So it can be better there, too.

But to effect change in our government, we have to participate in our government, which goes beyond voting every four years; it means writing to the representatives you or your neighbors have voted into office.

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're just as bad at identifying actual "weapons": I flew to South America with a layover in Miami a few years back. Got past TSA without any trouble on the domestic leg, then I had to go through again for the international leg. The second time through security, they said they saw a blade on the x-ray.. turns out they were right. I forgot I had left a multi-tool in my bag. Thankfully, they just trashed it and let m…

FYI you are allowed to carry on screwdrivers, wrenches and pliers less than 7 inches long. More bulky than a multi-tool, but at least you can carry something? https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/prohibited-ite...

I had a wine opener confiscated because of the 1 inch knife ... can't imagine how someone might use a wine opener to hijack a plane

Re: Catching a Flight? Budget Hours, Not Minutes, for Security

#130
It's not only TSA personnel (who are, on the whole, so incompetent I wouldn't hire most of the ones I meet to do ANYTHING), it's policy itself. Security policy in much of the world today is reactive and shortsighted - shoe bomber? take off your shoes, Underwear bomber, let's x-ray everyone, etc. etc. - all just to be able to say they "did something," whether or not is effective or efficient in any way at all.

I remember several years back when the shoe-removal policy has just been relatively new, and I was flying out of Israel. The security personnel there had someone devoted solely to going around telling people NOT to remove their shoes, in order to make sure the lines keep moving.

TSA just could not care less whether people actually make their flights, or whether terrorists get through, as long as they don't get blamed for missing something they should have caught.

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